Mixing Law & Grace

[God's Truth]

Of course you have to pervert the Scriptures again because your father is the devil.

The children of the devil preach obey God?

There were no "conditions" in what Peter preached to Cornelius.

The gospel is given to those who do right: Acts 13:26 "Fellow children of Abraham and you God-fearing Gentiles, it is to us that this message of salvation has been sent.

Jesus accepts those who do right: Acts 10:35 but that in every nation those who fear Him and live good lives are acceptable to Him.

Please tell me where in that sermon that Peter said that in order to be saved you have to obey the Lord Jesus.

Here is the message that saves that Cornelius and his whole household believed and were saved.

Acts 10:33 Now we are all here in the presence of God to listen to everything the Lord has commanded you to tell us.”

34 Then Peter began to speak: “I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism 35 but accepts from every nation the one who fears him and does what is right. 36 You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, announcing the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. 37 You know what has happened throughout the province of Judea, beginning in Galilee after the baptism that John preached— 38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him.

39 “We are witnesses of everything he did in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They killed him by hanging him on a cross, 40 but God raised him from the dead on the third day and caused him to be seen.41 He was not seen by all the people, but by witnesses whom God had already chosen—by us who ate and drank with him after he rose from the dead. 42 He commanded us to preach to the people and to testify that he is the one whom God appointed as judge of the living and the dead. 43 All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name.”

44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. 45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles. 46 For they heard them speaking in tongues and praising God.



The Gospel

In Acts 26:17 Jesus tells Paul he is sending him to the Jews and Gentiles to OPEN THEIR EYES and turn them from darkness to light and from the power of Satan to God.
How do you think Paul is going to open the eyes of the Jews and the Gentiles? Remember, faith comes from hearing the word, and Jesus sent Paul to preach the gospel.

Read what Paul says in Romans 16:25-27.

Now to him who is able to ESTABLISH YOU BY MY GOSPEL AND THE PROCLAMATION OF JESUS CHRIST, according to the revelation of the mystery hidden for long ages past, but now revealed and MADE KNOWN THROUGH THE PROPHETIC WRITINGS by the command of the eternal God, SO THAT ALL NATIONS MIGHT BELIEVE AND OBEY HIM–to the only wise God be glory forever through Jesus Christ! Amen.

Paul says that God made the prophetic writings known so that all nations might believe and obey. So again, the word of God tells us that faith comes from hearing the message. Paul teaches what we are supposed to obey.



So we see from the scriptures the message that saves, the gospel, is when we seek to be reconciled to God and repent of our sins and have Jesus wash those sins away, and then live to please the Lord.

So the fact of the matter is the truth that Cornelius was saved before he obeyed the Lord Jesus.

The scriptures plainly rebuke you. The Word of God says Cornelius was God fearing, righteous, a giver to the poor, and a man who prayed.

With that your perversion of the grace of God comes tumbling down like a child's house of cards. You teach that no one can be saved without doing works but it is a fact that Cornelius was saved when he believed.

Again, Cornelius was feared God. The scriptures say God's salvation is near those who fear Him.

Cornelius was righteous, he gave to the poor, and he prayed to God.

This is not complicated but you refuse to believe it and instead you roam around trying your best to pervert the gospel of grace in the hope you can deceive others so they will not be saved.

If people obeyed Jesus, they would enter the realm of the Spirit.

Something happens after obeying Jesus.

After you humble yourself and make yourself as a child ready to do everything that Jesus tells you, repent of your sins, promise to die to the sins of the world, and live to please Jesus, to forgive all who have sinned against you, and call on Jesus to help you, you will be saved.

Jesus says don't even come to him to be saved if you don't hate everyone and yourself in this world the way it is.

Jesus also says not to give up, give out, or give in, but to want to be saved and a child of God more than anything.

You are truly an evil person doing the work of Satan:

​

It is enough for students to be like their teachers, and servants like their masters. If the head of the house has been called Beelzebul, how much more the members of his household!

"But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them" (2 Cor.4:3-4).

You have sold your soul to the devil and your end will be in the lake of fire.

Romans 6:16
Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?

Romans 6:18; Romans 6:22; 1 Corinthians 7:22; 2 Timothy 2:24; Ephesians 6:6.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Earlier I quoted the following verse:

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.2:8-9).​

Then the person who calls herself " God's Truth" said the following:

People misunderstand Paul when he says ‘not of works’, for Paul is speaking of the purification/ceremonial works. Paul is not speaking of obedience being the ‘not of works’.

Of course the Gentile believers did not have the ceremonial law and neither were they circumcised so I asked what the phrase " not of works" means in regard to the Gentile believers. Here is her incredibility stupid answer:

The Gentiles COULD have converted by doing the ceremonial works, AND, they were separate from God and ENEIMIES of God BECAUSE they did NOT do the ceremonial works.
NOT only that, they KNEW they were separate because of the ceremonial works and were called uncircumcised and unclean people.

Despite the fact that Paul told the Gentile Christians that they are saved through faith the person who calls herself "God's Truth" says that "they were separate from God and ENEIMIES of God BECAUSE they did NOT do the ceremonial works."

That is the dumbest thing I have ever read on this forum. Anyone who will believe anything this fool says is also a fool!

 

[God's Truth]

Earlier I quoted the following verse:

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.2:8-9).​

Then the person who calls herself " God's Truth" said the following:



Of course the Gentile believers did not have the ceremonial law and neither were they circumcised so I asked what the phrase " not of works" means in regard to the Gentile believers. Here is her incredibility stupid answer:



Despite the fact that Paul told the Gentile Christians that they are saved through faith the person who calls herself "God's Truth" says that "they were separate from God and ENEIMIES of God BECAUSE they did NOT do the ceremonial works."

That is the dumbest thing I have ever read on this forum. Anyone who will believe anything this fool says is also a fool!

But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

 

[OZOS]

But I tell you that anyone who is angry with a brother or sister will be subject to judgment. Again, anyone who says to a brother or sister, ‘Raca,’ is answerable to the court. And anyone who says, ‘You fool!’ will be in danger of the fire of hell.

"Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?" - Jesus

"Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?" - Jesus

"Ye fools, did not he that made that which is without make that which is within also?" - Jesus

"But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?"

"Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken"

"Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools" - Apostle Paul

"Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die" - Apostle Paul

"O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you"


You lack the knowledge and Spirit as to understand the entirety of the Bible and the message of Christ (the gospel). YOU are an utter FOOL, void of His life, and destined for hell.

 

[God's Truth]

"Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?" - Jesus

"Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?" - Jesus

"Ye fools, did not he that made that which is without make that which is within also?" - Jesus

"But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided?"

"Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken"

"Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools" - Apostle Paul

"Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die" - Apostle Paul

"O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you"


You lack the knowledge and Spirit as to understand the entirety of the Bible and the message of Christ (the gospel). YOU are an utter FOOL, void of His life, and destined for hell.

For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

 

[beloved57]

That is nowhere in the scriptures.

Yes it is. The gospel is hidden from them that are lost 2 Cor 4:3

³ But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost

 

[Jerry Shugart]

But I tell you...

Tell me what the "works" are in the following verse in regard to the Gentiles who did not have the ceremonial law and were not circumcised:

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.2:8-9).​

 

[God's Truth]

Tell me what the "works" are in the following verse in regard to the Gentiles who did not have the ceremonial law and were not circumcised:

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.2:8-9).​

They could get saved now, but not by doing the ceremonial works, but by repenting of their sins and faith in Jesus.

 

[God's Truth]

Yes it is. The gospel is hidden from them that are lost 2 Cor 4:3

³ But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost

The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.


Remember the untruthful thing you said about God saving unbelievers?

 

[beloved57]

The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.


Remember the untruthful thing you said about God saving unbelievers?

As long as a person is lost the gospel is hidden from them. That's scripture!

 

[God's Truth]

As long as a person is lost the gospel is hidden from them. That's scripture!

At that time Jesus said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.


If you want to have it unhidden from you, you have to humble yourself as a little child.

 

[beloved57]

At that time Jesus said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.


If you want to have it unhidden from you, you have to humble yourself as a little child.

So before one can believe the Gospel they need to be saved first. As long as they are lost its hidden. You can't believe something that is hidden from you!

 

[God's Truth]

So before one can believe the Gospel they need to be saved first. As long as they are lost its hidden. You can't believe something that is hidden from you!

No such thing as being saved before you hear the gospel.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

They could get saved now, but not by doing the ceremonial works, but by repenting of their sins and faith in Jesus.

Are you really this dense? THEY ARE ALREADY SAVED!

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.2:8-9).​

Paul tells them that they are "saved through faith."

He doesn't say that they are saved by faith and by obedience! But you don't care.

 

[beloved57]

No such thing as being saved before you hear the gospel.

Okay keep thinking that! I gave you scripture reason

 

[beloved57]

Are you really this dense? THEY ARE ALREADY SAVED!

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.2:8-9).​

Paul tells them that they are "saved through faith."

He doesn't say that they are saved by faith and by obedience! But you don't care.

Don't you believe faith is a act of man's obedience?

 

[Jerry Shugart]

Don't you believe faith is a act of man's obedience?

Obedience comes as a result of faith:

"Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith" (Ro.16:25-26).​

 

[beloved57]

Obedience comes as a result of faith:

"Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began, But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith" (Ro.16:25-26).​

Is faith obedience or not ? That verse seems to say faith is obedience In Rom 10 it appears faith and obeying are one and the same. Rom 10:16-17

¹⁶ But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?

¹⁷ So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

So you chose the wrong verse!

 

[God's Truth]

Are you really this dense? THEY ARE ALREADY SAVED!

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast" (Eph.2:8-9).​

Paul tells them that they are "saved through faith."

He doesn't say that they are saved by faith and by obedience! But you don't care.

Paul is speaking about not doing the works to clean yourself. Because Jesus cleans us now.

The works to clean yourself used to be you had to be circumcised, do various external baths, adhere to a special diet, observe the special days, go to the priest, give animal sacrifices.

Those works used to save.

Jesus cleans us now, just by our having faith that his blood cleans us.

Think how wonderful that is.

We don't have to purify ourselves anymore day after day, but we still have to not murder, commit adultery, etc.

If anyone does sin, now they can just ask for forgiveness and work on not sinning.

 

[God's Truth]

Okay keep thinking that! I gave you scripture reason

Where does our faith come from? Our faith comes from HEARING the word, see Romans 10:17. From hearing the word and being TAUGHT, Colossians 1:5, 7. From continuing in what we have been CONVINCED of, see 2 Timothy 3:14, and being PERSUADED, 2 Corinthians 5:11.

We are saved in a very human way...hearing, being taught, persuaded... convinced...


There is no such scripture or teaching from God that says He saves unbelievers and causes them to believe without their knowing or wanting.

Faith is from God, from reading His powerful message, the Bible, the New Testament. It has the powerful message that saves. We do not get faith supernaturally, as many teach, but we get faith in a very human way, from reading and obeying the supernatural message!