meaning of Acts 1:5

[DAN P]

It reads , for John indeed baptized with water , but you will be baptized with water , but you will be baptized with Holy Spirit not many of these days after .

#1 Here we that water baptism was in force by John .

#2 but that Israel was to be baptized with Holy Spirit power not many days after .

#3 here we see to different kinds of baptism here ,

#4 water baptism

#5 and Holy Spirit is a gift , Acts 2:38

#6 and Acts 2:17-23 is a repeat of Acts 2:36-39

#7 under the gospel of grace there will never be water baptism as what was given to Israel by John 1:31 and we know that the Kingdom of Heaven preaching was never given to Paul .

dan p

 

[Right Divider]

It reads , for John indeed baptized with water , but you will be baptized with water , but you will be baptized with Holy Spirit not many of these days after .

#1 Here we that water baptism was in force by John .

Yes.

#2 but that Israel was to be baptized with Holy Spirit power not many days after .

Not all of Israel.

#3 here we see to different kinds of baptism here ,

There are many different kinds of baptism in the Bible. Baptism does NOT mean water.

#4 water baptism

One kind of baptism... even practiced in the OT.

#5 and Holy Spirit is a gift , Acts 2:38

Being baptized WITH the Spirit is not the same as being baptized BY the Spirit.

#6 and Acts 2:17-23 is a repeat of Acts 2:36-39

Not sure exactly what you mean.

#7 under the gospel of grace there will never be water baptism as what was given to Israel by John 1:31 and we know that the Kingdom of Heaven preaching was never given to Paul .

Paul never commands water baptism. That's a clue.
Paul was glad that he water baptized so few. That's another clue.

 

[Hoping]

It reads , for John indeed baptized with water , but you will be baptized with water , but you will be baptized with Holy Spirit not many of these days after .

#1 Here we that water baptism was in force by John .

#2 but that Israel was to be baptized with Holy Spirit power not many days after .

#3 here we see to different kinds of baptism here ,

#4 water baptism

#5 and Holy Spirit is a gift , Acts 2:38

#6 and Acts 2:17-23 is a repeat of Acts 2:36-39

#7 under the gospel of grace there will never be water baptism as what was given to Israel by John 1:31 and we know that the Kingdom of Heaven preaching was never given to Paul .

dan p

Why then did Paul water baptize the twelve at Ephesus? (Acts 19)
And all the men listed in 1 Cor 1?

 

[JudgeRightly]

Why then did Paul water baptize the twelve at Ephesus? (Acts 19)

Why do you assume Paul was the one to baptize them?

Why do you assume water was involved?

By "the twelve" are you referring to "The Twelve Apostles," namely, Peter, James, John, etc? Or do you recognize that there were twelve men whose names are unknown, but definitely not "The Twelve"?

And the all men listed in 1 Cor 1?

When were these people (men and women, by the way, as "the household of Stephanas" is mentioned) baptized?
Were they baptized:
A) early in Paul's ministry?
B) later in Paul's ministry?

 

[Hoping]

Why do you assume Paul was the one to baptize them?

I don't, really, as I can't imagine he was alone.
Acts 19:5..."When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus."
Just like Peter admonished in Acts 2:38..."Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."
Two baptisms from the very start.
Besides the name of the baptizer not being written, why would it matter after the fact who the twelve were water baptized by?

Why do you assume water was involved?

Because the baptism if the Holy Spirit is mentioned as occurring afterwards.
Two different baptisms are in play.
Acts 19:6..."And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied."
Just like Peter mentioned in Acts 2:38.

By "the twelve" are you referring to "The Twelve Apostles," namely, Peter, James, John, etc? Or do you recognize that there were twelve men whose names are unknown, but definitely not "The Twelve"?

I don't think twelve of the other apostles needed further baptizing.
Do you?

When were these people (men and women, by the way, as "the household of Stephanas" is mentioned) baptized?
Were they baptized:
A) early in Paul's ministry?
B) later in Paul's ministry?

The word doesn't say.
Perhaps at the same time many others at Corinth were baptized..."And Crispus, the chief ruler of the synagogue, believed on the Lord with all his house; and many of the Corinthians hearing believed, and were baptized." (Acts 18:8)

 

[JudgeRightly]

I don't, really, as I can't imagine he was alone.

Then why did you say...

Why then did Paul water baptize the twelve at Ephesus? (Acts 19)

If you don't believe that Paul was the one who did it?

Two baptisms from the very start.

Just like Israel... Hmmm...

Whereas with the Body of Christ, there is ONE baptism, not multiple..

Things that are different are not the same.

Besides the name of the baptizer not being written, why would it matter after the fact who the twelve were water baptized by?

Because of the distinction between the dispensation of grace given to Paul, versus the dispensation of the New Covenant given to the Twelve Apostles.

But you'll ignore that because of your a-priori beliefs.

Because the baptism if the Holy Spirit is mentioned as occurring afterwards.

What baptism of the Holy Spirit?

Reading things into the text, again?

Two different baptisms are in play.

I see one baptism with water in verse 3, and a baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus in verse 5. I don't see any baptism in verse 6, but you say there is.

So does that not make it three baptisms, according to you?

Now compare that with the ONE baptism for the Body of Christ.

Things that are diifferent are not the same.

Acts 19:6..."And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied."
Just like Peter mentioned in Acts 2:38.

So clearly not like what Paul was teaching to the gentiles...

I don't think twelve of the other apostles needed further baptizing.
Do you?

Your refusal to simply answer the question speaks volumes.

The word doesn't say.

Do you think that God revealed everything to Paul all at once?

Perhaps at the same time many others at Corinth were baptized..."And Crispus, the chief ruler of the synagogue, believed on the Lord with all his house; and many of the Corinthians hearing believed, and were baptized." (Acts 18:8)

You're the one who said:

Why then did Paul water baptize . . . [all the] men listed in 1 Cor 1?

Paul says He didn't baptize anyone except for Crispus, Gaius, and the Household of Stephanas. Are you calling him a liar?[/QUOTE]

 

[Right Divider]

Paul did not baptize anyone in Act 19:1-7. Paul was talking about what had happened long before...

Acts 19:1-7 (AKJV/PCE)
(19:1) And it came to pass, that, while Apollos was at Corinth, Paul having passed through the upper coasts came to Ephesus: and finding certain disciples, (19:2) He said unto them, Have ye received the Holy Ghost since ye believed? And they said unto him, We have not so much as heard whether there be any Holy Ghost. (19:3) And he said unto them, Unto what then were ye baptized? And they said, Unto John's baptism. (19:4) Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus. (19:5) When they heard [this], they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. (19:6) And when Paul had laid [his] hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied. (19:7) And all the men were about twelve.

Verse 5 is STILL Paul talking about what happened in verse 4. That is also why there is an AND to begin the next sentence in verse 6. The THEY in verse 5 refers to "the people" in verse 4.

 

[Hoping]

Then why did you say...
If you don't believe that Paul was the one who did it?

Nobody else but Paul is mentioned.

Just like Israel... Hmmm...

If you mean believers from Israel, yes !

Whereas with the Body of Christ, there is ONE baptism, not multiple..

Which one are you willing to forego?
The one done in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins?
Or the one given by God to the truly repentant?
Actually, you can only refuse the first, but then somehow expect God will reward you with the Holy Ghost in a still polluted "temple".

Things that are different are not the same.

It is your doctrine that separates the believing Jews from the believing Gentiles.
It has made two different churches when they are still one.

Because of the distinction between the dispensation of grace given to Paul, versus the dispensation of the New Covenant given to the Twelve Apostles.
But you'll ignore that because of your a-priori beliefs.

I believe what is written by holy folks.

What baptism of the Holy Spirit?

The one done when Paul put his hands on them..."And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied." (Acts 19:6)

Reading things into the text, again?

Nope, just reading texts.

I see one baptism with water in verse 3, and a baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus in verse 5.

They are the same water baptism, but now done in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins.

I don't see any baptism in verse 6, but you say there is.

I am surprised you can't see it. (Acts 19:6)

So does that not make it three baptisms, according to you?

Nope, one done by men at the behest of Christ Jesus, and Peter, and one done by God in response to a true repentance from sin.

Now compare that with the ONE baptism for the Body of Christ.
Things that are diifferent are not the same.

Only in your doctrine are they different.
I rejoice in my being enabled to partake in and of the Lord's body with Gentiles and Jews.

So clearly not like what Paul was teaching to the gentiles...

Do you really think the twelve at Ephesus, who had never heard of the Holy Ghost, were Jews?
LOL

Your refusal to simply answer the question speaks volumes.

Isn't it you who isn't responding?

Do you think that God revealed everything to Paul all at once?

Who cares?
God isn't going to make two churches that preach different manners of salvation.
Like you would have folks believe.

You're the one who said:

Yes.

Paul says He didn't baptize anyone except for Crispus, Gaius, and the Household of Stephanas. Are you calling him a liar?

Nope.
Perhaps Paul only listed the most prominent folks who would be well known by the church in Corinth and the surrounding area.
Or maybe he baptized five or ten, and let them baptize the others.
Just the fact he baptized anyone makes it clear to me that water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins was still a church commandment they adhered to.

 

[DAN P]

Why then did Paul water baptize the twelve at Ephesus? (Acts 19)
And the all men listed in 1 Cor 1?

Acts 19:4 the Greek word , BAPTISM / BAPTIZO is really a Greek BAPTISMA / is not water , but a BAPTIZER .

as to verse 4 and 5 the 12 baptizo / placed into , into the name of the Lord Jesus .

then in verse 6 , Paul , having laid hands upon them . Holy Spirit came upon them and they speaking in languages and were prophesying .

so we see that Paul did not water baptize them and what happened here is the same at Acts 2 , Pentecost .

dan p

 

[Hoping]

Acts 19:4 the Greek word , BAPTISM / BAPTIZO is really a Greek BAPTISMA / is not water , but a BAPTIZER .

Stretching now, are we?

as to verse 4 and 5 the 12 baptizo / placed into , into the name of the Lord Jesus .

Men were to be water baptized in the name-using the name-of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins. (Acts 2:38, 22:16)

then in verse 6 , Paul , having laid hands upon them . Holy Spirit came upon them and they speaking in languages and were prophesying .

The baptism of the Holy Ghost came after immersion in water, using the Lord's name, for the remission of past sins.

so we see that Paul did not water baptize them and what happened here is the same at Acts 2 , Pentecost .

Paul or his companions water baptized the twelve at Ephesus "in the name of Jesus Christ" for the remission of past sins.
John's water baptism unto repentance for the remission of sins didn't use the name of Jesus Christ.
Paul, or his companions, water baptized them again, calling on the name of Jesus Christ.
Than the gift of the Holy Ghost was given to them at the laying on of Paul's hands.
Just as the verses in Acts spell out.

 

[DAN P]

Why then did Paul water baptize the twelve at Ephesus? (Acts 19)
And all the men listed in 1 Cor 1?

We see that in Acts 18:8 that Paul was not water baptizing anyone .

Verse says that it was Crispus , the ruler of the synagogue , believed in the Lord with his whole house , and many n of the Corinthians hearing , were believing and were being baptized and from verse 7 , we can all see that Paul was not in the synagogue at all , and was in Justus house that was bordering on the synagogue ..

the main reason Paul could not water baptize anyone is in 1 Cor 15 , is the Greek lest / ME is a disjunctive particle negarive and neverrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr lest anyone should say that I baptized in my name .
and in Acts 18:4 John indeed baptized with a baptisma and the Greek word in not baptizo , normally translated baptism .

in verse 6 ,Paul having laid hands upon them , Holy Spirit came upon them , and they were speaking in languages and were prophesying and all the men were about 12 .

verse 6 is just what happened at PENTECOST .

dan p

 

[Hoping]

We see that in Acts 18:8 that Paul was not water baptizing anyone .

I disagree, as the baptism of Crispus is referred to in 1 Cor 1:14.

Verse says that it was Crispus , the ruler of the synagogue , believed in the Lord with his whole house , and many n of the Corinthians hearing , were believing and were being baptized and from verse 7 , we can all see that Paul was not in the synagogue at all , and was in Justus house that was bordering on the synagogue ..

What version of the KJV bible are you using?
That does not say "were believing".
The KJV says "believed, and were baptized".

the main reason Paul could not water baptize anyone is in 1 Cor 15 , is the Greek lest / ME is a disjunctive particle negarive and neverrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr lest anyone should say that I baptized in my name .

Scripture disagrees with your interpretation of scripture.
"Could not" ?
You are adding in your own POV.
Paul clearly says " I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name." (1 Cor 1:14-15)
He DID baptize folks.

and in Acts 18:4 John indeed baptized with a baptisma and the Greek word in not baptizo , normally translated baptism .
in verse 6 ,Paul having laid hands upon them , Holy Spirit came upon them , and they were speaking in languages and were prophesying and all the men were about 12 .

Are you really denying that two different baptisms are written of in Acts 19:5-6 ?
"Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied."

verse 6 is just what happened at PENTECOST .

Agreed, and still happening today !

 

[DAN P]

I disagree, as the baptism of Crispus is referred to in 1 Cor 1:14.

What version of the KJV bible are you using?
That does not say "were believing".
The KJV says "believed, and were baptized".

Scripture disagrees with your interpretation of scripture.
"Could not" ?
You are adding in your own POV.
Paul clearly says " I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name." (1 Cor 1:14-15)
He DID baptize folks.

Are you really denying that two different baptisms are written of in Acts 19:5-6 ?
"Then said Paul, John verily baptized with the baptism of repentance, saying unto the people, that they should believe on him which should come after him, that is, on Christ Jesus.
5 When they heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.
6 And when Paul had laid his hands upon them, the Holy Ghost came on them; and they spake with tongues, and prophesied."

Agreed, and still happening today !

Acts 19:4 is very hard for many to see or agree on .

And Paul said , John indeed baptized ( with ) a baptisma , which means that John was a baptisma for the nation on Israel ( John 1:31) and means that John was a water baptizer , not Paul .

no one can prove , from Acts 18:7 Paul when to the house of Crispus and in verse 8 it was Crispus that was doing the baptizing .

and then you say it is still happening today , where ??

dan p

 

[Hoping]

Acts 19:4 is very hard for many to see or agree on .

And Paul said , John indeed baptized ( with ) a baptisma , which means that John was a baptisma for the nation on Israel ( John 1:31) and means that John was a water baptizer , not Paul .

I don't see how you can make the baptisms Paul oversaw, or did, to be any different than John's, except for doing it in the name of Jesus Christ, and still for the remission of sins.

no one can prove , from Acts 18:7 Paul when to the house of Crispus and in verse 8 it was Crispus that was doing the baptizing .

1 Cor 1:14-16..."I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other."
Paul said he baptized Crispus.

and then you say it is still happening today , where ??

Water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins is still being done by the "Church by Christ Jesus (Eph. 3:21)", just as it was from the very beginning.

 

[DAN P]

I don't see how you can make the baptisms Paul oversaw, or did, to be any different than John's, except for doing it in the name of Jesus Christ, and still for the remission of sins.

1 Cor 1:14-16..."I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other."
Paul said he baptized Crispus.

Water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins is still being done by the "Church by Christ Jesus (Eph. 3:21)", just as it was from the very beginning.

Where in the in the very beginning did it happen ?

dan p

 

[Hoping]

Where in the very beginning did it happen ?

dan p

The very beginning of baptism for the remission of sins was by John The Baptist.
Luke 3:3..."And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;"
The first time it was "in the name of Jesus Christ" was after Peter answered the quarries of the visiting Jews at Jerusalem on the day of Pentecost.
Acts 2:38..."Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

 

[DAN P]

The very beginning of baptism for the remission of sins was by John The Baptist.
Luke 3:3..."And he came into all the country about Jordan, preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins;"
The first time it was "in the name of Jesus Christ" was after Peter answered the quarries of the visiting Jews at Jerusalem on the day of Pentecost.
Acts 2:38..."Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

without a doubt , what you have written , is all context , of Israel and not about the b o c .

dan p

 

[Hoping]

without a doubt , what you have written , is all context , of Israel and not about the b o c .

dan p

Who is the true Israel?
It is those born of Isaac.
Isn't Jesus born of Isaac? Yes.
Is Jesus afraid to call us brethren? No.
Are we reborn of God's seed, like Jesus was? Yes.
Everyone who has been reborn of God's seed is the true Israel.
The body of Christ is Christ, and every convert is in Him, whether they are Jew, Gentile, man, woman, white, black, or Chinese.
"For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones." (Eph 5:30)

You write as though you were afraid of being one with the believing Israelis.

 

[DAN P]

Who is the true Israel?
It is those born of Isaac.
Isn't Jesus born of Isaac? Yes.
Is Jesus afraid to call us brethren? No.
Are we reborn of God's seed, like Jesus was? Yes.
Everyone who has been reborn of God's seed is the true Israel.
The body of Christ is Christ, and every convert is in Him, whether they are Jew, Gentile, man, woman, white, black, or Chinese.
"For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones." (Eph 5:30)

You write as though you were afraid of being one with the believing Israelis.

there is a difference of being a Jew and will live in the millennial kingdom and being in Christ and live in God's universe and govern his universe and govern angels , 1 Cor 6:1-3 ,

would like , if you present verses with your proof , just asking ?

dan p

 

[Hoping]

there is a difference of being a Jew and will live in the millennial kingdom and being in Christ and live in God's universe and govern his universe and govern angels , 1 Cor 6:1-3 ,

The future may hold different results for Jewish believers and Gentile believers, but both Jews and Gentiles are of the same "body" today.

would like , if you present verses with your proof , just asking ?

Can you be more precise with your question?
What would you like me to prove with scripture?

dan p