Jews Dont Even Keep The Law

Jacob

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I said
Wake up your still blind. Jesus changed the definition of justice.
JESUS NEW TESTAMENT JUSTICE
Matt 12:18-21
18 "Behold, My Servant whom I have chosen, my Beloved in whom My soul is well pleased! I will put My Spirit upon Him, and He will declare justice to the Gentiles.
19 He will not quarrel nor cry out, nor will anyone hear His voice in the streets.
20 A bruised reed He will not break, and smoking flax He will not quench, till He sends forth justice to victory;
21 And in His name Gentiles will trust."
Matt 6:14-15
14 "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
15 "But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.
Luke 6:37
37 "Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.
Matt 7:2-5
2 "For with what judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with the measure you use, it will be measured back to you.
3 "And why do you look at the speck in your brother's eye, but do not consider the plank in your own eye?
4 "Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me remove the speck from your eye'; and look, a plank is in your own eye?
5 "Hypocrite! First remove the plank from your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck out of your brother's eye.
Rom 2:12-14
12 For as many as have sinned without law will also perish without law, and as many as have sinned in the law will be judged by the law
13 (for not the hearers of the law are just in the sight of God, but the doers of the law will be justified;
14 for when Gentiles, who do not have the law, by nature do the things in the law, these, although not having the law, are a law to themselves,
Gal 6:2-7
2 Bear one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ.
3 For if anyone thinks himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceives himself.
4 But let each one examine his own work, and then he will have rejoicing in himself alone, and not in another.
5 For each one shall bear his own load.
6 Let him who is taught the word share in all good things with him who teaches.
7 Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap.
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
Rom 8:1-2
1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
Heb 2:1-5
1 Therefore we must give the more earnest heed to the things we have heard, lest we drift away.
2 For if the word spoken through angels proved steadfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just reward,
3 how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him,
4 God also bearing witness both with signs and wonders, with various miracles, and gifts of the Holy Spirit, according to His own will?
5 For He has not put the world to come, of which we speak, in subjection to angels.
(NKJ)
xxxNew testament justice is you will receive what ever you dish out. Jesus never dished out any kind of punishment on others. He always turned the other cheek. And even on the cross Jesus was praying to God the Father to forgive us. If you forgive you will be forgiven, if you do not forgive neither will God forgive you. Jesus changed the definition of justice. Every time someone does you wrong, you have an opportunity to be forgiven for something you have done wrong to God. Because the same measure of anything you use, like mercy, forgiveness, compassion, or wrath, emotions, reveange will be measure back to you by God.Old testament justice was an eye for an eye. YOU CANT KEEP BOTH.


Acts 8:32-33
32 The place in the Scripture which he read was this: "He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and as a lamb before its shearer is silent, so He opened not His mouth.
33 In His humiliation His justice was taken away, and who will declare His generation? For His life is taken from the earth."
(NKJ)


Matt 18:23-35
23 "Therefore the kingdom of heaven is like a certain king who wanted to settle accounts with his servants.
24 "And when he had begun to settle accounts, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents.
25 "But as he was not able to pay, his master commanded that he be sold, with his wife and children and all that he had, and that payment be made.
26 "The servant therefore fell down before him, saying, 'Master, have patience with me, and I will pay you all.'
27 "Then the master of that servant was moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt.
28 "But that servant went out and found one of his fellow servants who owed him a hundred denarii; and he laid hands on him and took him by the throat, saying, 'Pay me what you owe!'
29 "So his fellow servant fell down at his feet and begged him, saying, 'Have patience with me, and I will pay you all.'
30 "And he would not, but went and threw him into prison till he should pay the debt.
31 "So when his fellow servants saw what had been done, they were very grieved, and came and told their master all that had been done.
32 "Then his master, after he had called him, said to him, 'You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt because you begged me.
33 'Should you not also have had compassion on your fellow servant, just as I had pity on you?'
34 "And his master was angry, and delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him.
35 "So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses."
(NKJ)

xxx Even the old testament told us what the new justice would be when the deliverer comes

Isa 42:1-4

1 "Behold! My Servant whom I uphold, my Elect One in whom My soul delights! I have put My Spirit upon Him; he will bring forth justice to the Gentiles.
2 He will not cry out, nor raise His voice, nor cause His voice to be heard in the street.
3 A bruised reed He will not break, and smoking flax He will not quench; he will bring forth justice for truth.
4 He will not fail nor be discouraged, till He has established justice in the earth; and the coastlands shall wait for His law."
(NKJ)
Shalom.

Today is Chamishi, 12-21. From evening to morning. And from night to day.

I do not know what you are talking about now.

Shalom.

Jacob
 

Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
Shalom.

Today is Chamishi, 12-21. From evening to morning. And from night to day.

I do not know what you are talking about now.

Shalom.

Jacob

I said
Jesus changed the definition of the word justice. Just like He changed the word righteousness.
 

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
I said
Jesus changed the definition of the word justice. Just like He changed the definition of the word righteousness.

Shalom.

Definitions of words do not change. There may be a different usage of a word. Or, another definition may be given. From one Dictionary with time might a word have a different definition?

You may be speaking of, or thinking that there is, a different or new concept using a particular word, like justice or righteousness. I can see how that might be (what you are saying). However, I don't know that it is. I do know that sometimes people believe what you have said here. To understand something we need the insight to understand it. Righteousness is still righteousness. Jesus fulfilled all righteousness. Justice is still justice. The Hebrew understanding of the word from this word might be different than our English understanding of this word. But God is still the Judge. There is still justice in this world. Things do not always appear just. But in the end God's perfect justice wins out. Justice is different than fairness. God is fair and just. Something may not seem fair. But God is always just.

Acts 10:42 NASB - "And He ordered us to preach to the people, and solemnly to testify that this is the One who has been appointed by God as Judge of the living and the dead.

Acts 17:31 KJV - Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by [that] man whom he hath ordained; [whereof] he hath given assurance unto all [men], in that he hath raised him from the dead.

What were you thinking? I want to hear more about what you were wanting to say, what you said, what you have said here.

Shalom.

Jacob
 

Tnkrbl123!

New member
Shalom.

By God's grace I hope that we can recover from your words here. I am here sharing the truth of God's word with you. My understanding is that you prohibit people from studying All Scripture. Is it true that to have nt scripture you have to have ot scripture? If the only scripture there is is nt.

Shalom.

Jacob

I agree because in the NT Jesus said that not one jot or tittle of the scripture will be wiped away or made obsolete until The King returns (we both know that jot and tittle refer to the written word).
And of course this is referring to the OT because when Jesus said this none of the NT was written yet because this was written as a record of Jesus words AFTER he died......and before He died there was only OT. I don't think we can get more clear than that :) And it is referring to those who tell people not to read the OT will be called the LEAST. It is all quite clear and for many other reasons than this..... I don't understand how some people can't understand this simple truth can you? ;)

Jesus'words......
" Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven." Matthew 5:17-20
 

Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
Shalom.

Definitions of words do not change. There may be a different usage of a word. Or, another definition may be given. From one Dictionary with time might a word have a different definition?

You may be speaking of, or thinking that there is, a different or new concept using a particular word, like justice or righteousness. I can see how that might be (what you are saying). However, I don't know that it is. I do know that sometimes people believe what you have said here. To understand something we need the insight to understand it. Righteousness is still righteousness. Jesus fulfilled all righteousness. Justice is still justice. The Hebrew understanding of the word from this word might be different than our English understanding of this word. But God is still the Judge. There is still justice in this world. Things do not always appear just. But in the end God's perfect justice wins out. Justice is different than fairness. God is fair and just. Something may not seem fair. But God is always just.

Acts 10:42 NASB - "And He ordered us to preach to the people, and solemnly to testify that this is the One who has been appointed by God as Judge of the living and the dead.

Acts 17:31 KJV - Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by [that] man whom he hath ordained; [whereof] he hath given assurance unto all [men], in that he hath raised him from the dead.

What were you thinking? I want to hear more about what you were wanting to say, what you said, what you have said here.

Shalom.

Jacob

I said
Righteousness is anything said or done that pleases God. What pleased God in the old testament like an eye for an eye. Is not more pleasing God in the new testament. Forgiving everyone that sins against you is what pleases God now.

Old Testament
[Deu 19:21
21 "Your eye shall not pity: life [shall be] for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.

New Testament
[Mat 6:14
14 "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
 

Jacob

BANNED
Banned
I said
Righteousness is anything said or done that pleases God. What pleased God in the old testament like an eye for an eye. Is not more pleasing God in the new testament. Forgiving everyone that sins against you is what pleases God now.

Old Testament
[Deu 19:21
21 "Your eye shall not pity: life [shall be] for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot.

New Testament
[Mat 6:14
14 "For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.

Shalom.

Please allow me to here admit that I do not understand your words here. You can read them and explain if that helps.

Shalom.

Jacob
 

freelight

Eclectic Theosophist
The laws are eternal, and only realized by the principles that sustain them......

The laws are eternal, and only realized by the principles that sustain them......

Satan wants everyone under the old testament law. Because that is where his authority is, as the wrath of God according to the old testament law.

I dont know Squeaky,

Its all cherry-picking anyways.

You have the earliest followers of Jesus keeping most all the Jewish laws, customs and traditions, fully continued by Jesus brother James the Just in the Jerusalem Commnunity, for years after Jesus left the earth, ....did James and the original apostles (the pillars!) NOT get the memo from Jesus that the law and the prophets were all over with? Come on,....Paul came along and just added more complexity, subterfuge and gnostic allegory into the mix, which was more palatable to the Gentiles, since Paul barely made it out of Jerusalem being on the Jews hitlist, he barely made it out alive a few times, then went back to preach his gospel to the pagans who found his teachings easier to assimilate than full on hardcore Judaism. - his kick on 'circumcision' was just the tip of the iceberg. Ouch.

Furthermore, the 'God' of the OT fully informs his people that they CAN OBEY all his laws, and further gives them the spiritual ability and grace to DO SO! - the law is not too hard or far away from them, but its the very laws and principles that he is putting in their hearts, minds and mouths,....the integral system and all potencies to obey THE LAW are given by this Deity, by his own words, it is not far from them, or too difficult. Any half baked bible scholar knows this. BUT Paul reverses what YHWH says, and then changes the passage on this about some 'confession' to believe in your heart and confess with your mouth that God raised Jesus from the dead, and you're saved, thats all! Whala! - his quote from the OT has nothing to do with such an event, but concerns the law that YHWH gives his people, about the TORAH, being renewed in their hearts, where God by his SPIRIT empowers and enables them to obey it. ( this is the renewed covenant, renewed within his people).

I'm all for innovations, but Paul took the ball and ran with it, forming his own branch of 'Christianity'. - this just adds to some confusion of bible believers, as to whether to hold to the gospel of Jesus and his original apostles OR follow Paul's self proclaimed gospel to the Gentiles, with its gnostic, pagan, platonic innovations and expanded cosmology. Some try to synthesize this, or explain it away somehow, or some take a more rigid stance in rejecting Paul completely, besides those teachings or allegories that have universal value or truth, withstanding his more erratic claims. Just believe God raised some man from the dead, and confess it happened and you're saved is FAR From a Jewish concept of salvation, VERY FAR FROM (and thats just for starters).

And so the 'new covenant' is not really a NEW covenant, but a 'renewed' one in Jewish eyes, although pagan gnostic christians can spin the concept in new ways and create their own religion, assuming a spiritual Christ is being formed in the soul, and shall arise and fuse with the soul, enabling it to "put on immortality" and ascend into some heavenly realm. Spin it at you wish, the law of God is still somehow wed to the soul, and must be infused into the heart, where the Spirit of God there inspires, renews and quickens that living word to effect a real transformation. - and it is ONLY THEN, by the Spirit of God that a true religion can even BE, and there be lived out by the love and spirit that the law is born out from, and sustained thereby. Hence by their fruit you shall know them, and only faith that is activated is living and real faith. Lip service does not avail, unless accompanied with ACTION.

In the end, if the law of God is eternal, and SIN is only some transgression of law, then it is a complete and total conversion and committment to the law itself, to LOVE itself that is salvation, whereby thru love we live the law, fulfill the law and become a law unto ourselves, completely perfected by LOVE. - this is what ultimately has value and sustenance, as the essence and potential of life itself.
 

Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
Shalom.

Please allow me to here admit that I do not understand your words here. You can read them and explain if that helps.

Shalom.

Jacob

I said
The definition of the word justice in the old testament is an eye for an eye.
The definition of the word justice in the new testament is to be forgiven of your sins, you must forgive everybody else of their sins. Or your not forgiven.
 

Jacob

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Banned
I said
The definition of the word justice in the old testament is an eye for an eye.
The definition of the word justice in the new testament is to be forgiven of your sins, you must forgive everybody else of their sins. Or your not forgiven.
Shalom.

Today is Chamishi, 12-21.

I do not understand how you say that forgiveness is the definition of justice in the new testament. According to old covenant law, justice was to be meted out with equity, an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth a life for a life. In the new testament the punishment is more severe. If I understand Hebrews that way that is. You are right that if you do not forgive other people their sins you will not be forgiven your sins.

Shalom.

Jacob
 

Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
Shalom.

Today is Chamishi, 12-21.

I do not understand how you say that forgiveness is the definition of justice in the new testament. According to old covenant law, justice was to be meted out with equity, an eye for an eye a tooth for a tooth a life for a life. In the new testament the punishment is more severe. If I understand Hebrews that way that is. You are right that if you do not forgive other people their sins you will not be forgiven your sins.

Shalom.

Jacob

I said
lol You bounce around like a ball. You say you don't understand then you say you do. That is called an oxymoron.
 

Squeaky

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Shalom.

I don't know what you refer to but you are incorrect about that.

Shalom.

Jacob

I said
ROFLOL That is an oxymoron. If you don't know what I am referring to, you cant say it is incorrect with any sense of truth. You just make all this stuff up as you go. lol
 

Jacob

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I said
ROFLOL That is an oxymoron. If you don't know what I am referring to, you cant say it is incorrect with any sense of truth. You just make all this stuff up as you go. lol

Shalom.

I don't know what you refer to referred to your first two sentences. Your third sentence was incorrect.

Shalom.

Jacob
 

Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
Shalom.

I don't know what you refer to referred to your first two sentences. Your third sentence was incorrect.

Shalom.

Jacob

I said
Truth is always based on proof and evidence. You have neither, but you make claims and say they are truth. Which means your lying when you talk and make claims you cant prove.
 

Jacob

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I said
Truth is always based on proof and evidence. You have neither, but you make claims and say they are truth. Which means your lying when you talk and make claims you cant prove.

No. I don't accept that.

However, in line with what you are thinking and all the glory to God and Jesus Christ Jesus did not have the problem you are describing. He was the proof. He was the evidence. Or, because Jesus always did what the Father had for Him to do, and always said what the Father had for Him to say, there was never a disagreement between God and Jesus in regard to truth or in regard to the truth. God gave Him what He was to do and say.

Shalom.

Jacob
 

Squeaky

BANNED
Banned
No. I don't accept that.

However, in line with what you are thinking and all the glory to God and Jesus Christ Jesus did not have the problem you are describing. He was the proof. He was the evidence. Or, because Jesus always did what the Father had for Him to do, and always said what the Father had for Him to say, there was never a disagreement between God and Jesus in regard to truth or in regard to the truth. God gave Him what He was to do and say.

Shalom.

Jacob

I said
lololol You just admitted I was right.
 

Jacob

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Banned
I said
We have had to go through a lot of demons in you to get you to admit anything.

If there is something that I have done wrong I want to admit to it. If we are talking about the truth there is nothing to admit to.
 
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