Jesus saves unbelievers !

[7djengo7]

Jesus surely saves unbelievers, particularly them that are of His Sheep given Him of the Father John 10:29.

Their unbelief was never counted against them, and are the only unbelievers that shall be Saved.

If their unbelief was never counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having their unbelief counted against them. If their unbelief was never counted against them, then what (if anything) was counted against them? If nothing was ever counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having something counted against them. No? So, what did they need to be saved from?

 

[beloved57]

True, because in their own mind it was what they did that makes the difference between being saved and not lost; while other sinners had the same opportunity they had but failed to take advantage of it, and so have reason to boast over others.

Exactly !

 

[beloved57]

If their unbelief was never counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having their unbelief counted against them. If their unbelief was never counted against them, then what (if anything) was counted against them? If nothing was ever counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having something counted against them. No? So, what did they need to be saved from?

All their sins that merited their damnation to include unbelief, were charged to Christ and not to them, so their [sins/unbelief] cant be justly charged to them also. Thats why Paul writes in Rom 8:33-34

³³ Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth. ³⁴ Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

If the charge of unbelief could be charged to them for whom Christ died, it means Christ didnt die for their sins to include unbelief.

So if unbelief could be charged to the elect, it would be double jeopardy and injustice on Gods part !

 

[Nanja]

All their sins that merited their damnation to include unbelief, were charged to Christ and not to them, so their [sins/unbelief] cant be justly charged to them also. Thats why Paul writes in Rom 8:33-34

³³ Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth. ³⁴ Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

If the charge of unbelief could be charged to them for whom Christ died, it means Christ didnt die for their sins to include unbelief.

So if unbelief could be charged to the elect, it would be double jeopardy and injustice on Gods part !

Perfectly stated, Brother !

 

[beloved57]

Perfectly stated, Brother !

Thanks Sister !

 

[Nanja]

Thanks Sister !

You're so Welcome my Brother !

 

[7djengo7]

All their sins that merited their damnation to include unbelief, were charged to Christ and not to them, so their [sins/unbelief] cant be justly charged to them also. Thats why Paul writes in Rom 8:33-34

³³ Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God’s elect? It is God that justifieth. ³⁴ Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.

If the charge of unbelief could be charged to them for whom Christ died, it means Christ didnt die for their sins to include unbelief.

So if unbelief could be charged to the elect, it would be double jeopardy and injustice on Gods part !

Again:

If their unbelief was never counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having their unbelief counted against them. If their unbelief was never counted against them, then what (if anything) was counted against them? If nothing was ever counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having something counted against them. No? So, from what did they need to be saved??

 

[beloved57]

Again:

If their unbelief was never counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having their unbelief counted against them. If their unbelief was never counted against them, then what (if anything) was counted against them? If nothing was ever counted against them, then they never needed to be saved from having something counted against them. No? So, from what did they need to be saved??

I just answered.

 

[7djengo7]

I just answered.

Oh, well, then you must have written your answer in invisible ink, or mis-posted it elsewhere than in this thread. In any case, you'll not have answered my question,

So, from what did they need to be saved??​

until you say something along the lines of,

​

"They needed to be saved from _______________",​

​

having filled in the blank for me with the answer you claim you have for the question I asked you. Until you've filled in that blank for me, you've not answered the question I asked you.

 

[beloved57]

Oh, well, then you must have written your answer in invisible ink, or mis-posted it elsewhere than in this thread. In any case, you'll not have answered my question,

So, from what did they need to be saved??​

until you say something along the lines of,

​

"They needed to be saved from _______________",​

​

having filled in the blank for me with the answer you claim you have for the question I asked you. Until you've filled in that blank for me, you've not answered the question I asked you.

See post 22 !

 

[7djengo7]

See post 22 !

Ah, just what I expected. In post #22, neither you, nor anybody else, has answered the question I asked you:

So, from what did they need to be saved??
"They needed to be saved from _______________."

 

[Bright Raven]

Isn't this against the Doctrine of the Elect?

 

[beloved57]

Ah, just what I expected. In post #22, neither you, nor anybody else, has answered the question I asked you:

So, from what did they need to be saved??
"They needed to be saved from _______________."

See post 22 !

 

[7djengo7]

See post 22 !

Hmmm. Still nothing there. Sorry. I guess you're happy with your incompetence to answer the question I asked you:

So, from what did they need to be saved??
"They needed to be saved from _______________."

 

[beloved57]

Hmmm. Still nothing there. Sorry. I guess you're happy with your incompetence to answer the question I asked you:

So, from what did they need to be saved??
"They needed to be saved from _______________."

Havent I told you to see past 22 !!

 

[7djengo7]

Havent I told you to see past 22 !!

See post #34.

 

[Child of God]

Isn't this against the Doctrine of the Elect?

Yes it is.

 

[God's Truth]

Jesus says to believe or you will die in your sins.

John 8:24 I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins."


Jesus does not ever say that he makes people believe and obey without their wanting and knowing.

 

[Bright Raven]

They became believers after they heard the gospel message and believed it.

then they were unbelievers.

 

[Stuu]

Jesus says to believe or you will die in your sins. John 8:24 I told you that you would die in your sins; if you do not believe that I am he, you will indeed die in your sins. Jesus does not ever say that he makes people believe and obey without their wanting and knowing.

If 2 Thessalonians 1:8 doesn't make it compulsory then I don't know what would.

Stuart [h=3][/h]