what's kenosis ?
ECT Jesus one and only nature
- Thread starter 0scar
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keypurr
Well-known member
Christ is the express image of God the Father, and he is spirit not man. You seemed to have overlooked that. Christ became man by dwelling in Jesus. The fact that Jesus is god's flesh son, who was born to Mary is confused with the son that God sent, his spiritual son Christ. Christ was the Father's first creation. God created everything THROUGH Christ. Jesus was a man, a pure sinless man. This is how the son was sent, to dwell in a special man. Christ is a form of God, not God himself. Christ is the son that was with God and is a god as told in John 1. Christ became man to die for us.
0scar
New member
no where we read such a nonsence.
keypurr
Well-known member
I guess your the kind of theologian that just skims over the words in scripture sometimes. You will find my thoughts come from there if you look hard enough.
Like Christ is an image in Heb 1:3.
Can you disprove my thoughts with the Bible?
you acknowledge Christ Is a form of God. then say, but, it's not God. a form of God Is God. Jesus Christ Is God, who lived on earth :argue:
Php 2:5 Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus,
Php 2:6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
Php 2:7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.
Php 2:8 Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.-NASB
Kenosis:
"κενόω
kenóō; contracted kenṓ, fut. kenṓsō, from kenós (G2756), empty, void. To make empty, to empty, falsify, be fallacious.
(I) The antithesis of plēróō (G4137), to fill. Kenóō is used in Rom_4:14; 1Co_1:17; 1Co_9:15; 2Co_9:3; Php_2:7 meaning to empty oneself, to divest oneself of rightful dignity by descending to an inferior condition, to abase oneself.
(II) The use in Php_2:7 is of great theological importance. It refers to Jesus Christ as emptying Himself at the time of His incarnation, denoting the beginning of His self-humiliation in verse eight. In order to understand what is meant by Jesus' emptying Himself, the whole passage (Php_2:6-8) must be examined.
The two states of the Lord Jesus are spoken about here. In verse seven, the state of His humiliation is referred to as having taken "the form [morphḗn {G3444} {acc.}] of a servant [doúlou {G1401} {acc.}]," and having become "in the likeness [homoiṓmati {G3667}{dat.}] of men [anthrṓpōn {G444}{gen. pl.}]." In contrast to this, we have His preincarnate, eternal state spoken of in verse six as "being in the form [morphḗ] of God," and "equal [ísa {G2470}] with God." The truth expressed here concerning His preincarnate state is that He had to be equal with God in order to have the form of God. He could not be God the Son without being Deity. He who showed us the morphḗ of God, the form of God, the essence of God, had to be equal with God Himself.
The fact that Christ in His human form showed us God presupposes His being God at all times. He never claimed to be something without really being that in His essence. If He had, He would have been making a false claim.
As to the use of the subst. harpagmós (G725), robbery or plunder, see the verb harpázō (G726), to seize, catch, pluck or pull (2Co_12:2, 2Co_12:4; 1Th_4:17; Jud_2:3; Rev_12:5). As a subst., harpagmós is used only in Php_2:6. It refers to Christ's not taking that which did not belong to Him by being in the form of God. His whole life was characterized by being (hupárchōn [G5225]) that which He always was. Prior to His incarnation He was in the form, the essence of God, and after His incarnation He was still in the form of God in spite of His voluntary humiliation.
Notwithstanding His essence of deity, He took upon Himself the true essence of a servant (morphḗn doúlou). In order to be a servant, however, He had to become a man and appear in the likeness of men (en homoiṓmati anthrṓpōn). By doing this He emptied Himself of the proper recognition that He had with the Father as God who is Spirit (pneúma [G4151]; Joh_4:24) and entered into the world of men, most of whom did not at all recognize Him for who He was. The use of the aor. act. part. labṓn (lambánō [G2983], to take), having taken (with reference to the form of a servant), indicates that humanity did not displace deity in His personality. Rather He took upon Himself voluntarily, in addition to His preincarnate condition, something which veiled His deity. Proper recognition is called dóxa (G1391), glory, praise, from the verb dokéō (G1380), to recognize. In the form of man and servant, He lacked the recognition among men that He had with the Father (Joh_17:5). This voluntary humiliation of Christ began with the incarnation and was carried through to His crucifixion. In His resurrection, He laid aside His form of a servant.
(III) The word kenóō, to make empty, is used metaphorically as meaning to bring to nothing in the sense of not accomplishing what one set out to accomplish as in Rom_4:14, the faith not accomplishing its purpose. Used as an adj. in reference to the cross of Christ, meaning the cross not accomplishing its purpose, i.e., salvation for unbelieving man (1Co_1:17-18). In the same manner, life can be vain or empty, not accomplishing its God-intended purpose (1Co_9:15; 2Co_9:3).
Syn.: mataióō (G3154), to render vain, without meaning or fulfillment.
Ant.: plēróō (G4137), to fill; pímplēmi and plḗthō (G4130), to fill; gemízō (G1072), to fill or load fully; mestóō (G3325), to be full."- Spiros Zodhiates- Complete Word Study Dictionary
:jawdrop: - wow ! thank you very much. that was a great post. i am blessed to understand the words and definitions, without necessarily knowing one-word definitions; kenosis. i understand that when i read The Bible without defining it. you have done extensive study and i appreciate the clarity. no one can really argue with it. i break things down to simple terms, for lack of the right words of explanation. i say "Jesus Is God" and just expect everybody to read The Bible and get it on their own. i don't need to research greek or latin or hebrew for definitions and meaning or context. fortunately, english comes through clearly for me, but other languages always re-affirm my interpretations. thank you again ! - :thumb:
scripture disproves your thoughts. that seems like jehova witness' pattern. they deflect questions by asking questions and asking if you disagree with them. they pick isolated verses and ask if you believe it. pretty soon you are agreeing with nearly everything they say. tricky and slick. manipulative. controlling. doom and gloom:shut:
And since the Son is Deity we should be happy to share our inheritance from our Father with him. Children should share with each other.
The LORD Jesus is the 'monogenes'- only one generated, unique Son of GOD, one of a kind.
Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.- KJV
Joh 1:18 No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.- NASB
"The only begotten Son (ho monogenēs huios). This is the reading of the Textus Receptus and is intelligible after hōs monogenous para patros in Joh_1:14. But the best old Greek manuscripts (Aleph B C L) read monogenēs theos (God only begotten) which is undoubtedly the true text. Probably some scribe changed it to ho monogenēs huios to obviate the blunt statement of the deity of Christ and to make it like Joh_3:16. But there is an inner harmony in the reading of the old uncials. The Logos is plainly called theos in Joh_1:1. The Incarnation is stated in Joh_1:14, where he is also termed monogenēs. He was that before the Incarnation. So he is “God only begotten,” “the Eternal Generation of the Son” of Origen’s phrase.
Which is in the bosom of the Father (ho ōn eis ton kolpon tou patros). The eternal relation of the Son with the Father like pros ton theon in Joh_1:1. In Joh_3:13 there is some evidence for ho ōn en tōi ouranōi used by Christ of himself while still on earth. The mystic sense here is that the Son is qualified to reveal the Father as Logos (both the Father in Idea and Expression) by reason of the continual fellowship with the Father."- Word Pictures- AT Robertson(renowned Greek scholar)
OCTOBER23
New member
OSCAR THE CAT.
WE ARE GOD'S CHILDREN AND HEIRS OF CHRIST AND WILL BECOME GODS
--JESUS WAS AT THE PASSOVER ON TUESDAY NIGHT
-- CRUCIFIED ON WEDNESDAY AND PUT IN THE TOMB BY HIS FATHER JOSEPH
JESUS SPENT 3 1/2 DAYS IN THE TOMB AND RAISED JUST BEFORE DAWN
AT THE END OF THE 24 HOUR SABBATH.
-- WENT UP TO THE FATHER
-- CAME BACK AND PREACHED FOR 40 DAYS
-- WENT BACK UP AND WAS CHANGED BACK INTO A GOD BY THE FATHER
-- WE WILL BE CHANGED TO GODS TOO.
WE ARE GOD'S CHILDREN AND HEIRS OF CHRIST AND WILL BECOME GODS
--JESUS WAS AT THE PASSOVER ON TUESDAY NIGHT
-- CRUCIFIED ON WEDNESDAY AND PUT IN THE TOMB BY HIS FATHER JOSEPH
JESUS SPENT 3 1/2 DAYS IN THE TOMB AND RAISED JUST BEFORE DAWN
AT THE END OF THE 24 HOUR SABBATH.
-- WENT UP TO THE FATHER
-- CAME BACK AND PREACHED FOR 40 DAYS
-- WENT BACK UP AND WAS CHANGED BACK INTO A GOD BY THE FATHER
-- WE WILL BE CHANGED TO GODS TOO.
Yes, Jesus was the only son begotten by the Holy Spirit, the rest of of us have had human fathers. So?
Nothing you posted suggests we should not share our inheritance from God with Jesus. Jesus is also a son of God just as much as we are.
(The same had not consented to the counsel and deed of them), he was of Arimathaea, a city of the Jews who also himself waited for the kingdom of God. (Luke 23:51)
Joseph from Arimathea was not Jesus' step dad. Jesus as the elder son gave custody of his mother to John.
0scar
New member
I dont have to disprove that Heb 1:3 say Christ is a spirit living inside Jesus. It simply doesent. Can you disprove that Heb 1:3 say that Jesus is an alien came in a UFO?
0scar
New member
Php 2:5 Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Christ Jesus,
Php 2:6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
Php 2:7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.
Php 2:8 Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.-NASB
Kenosis:
"κενόω
kenóō; contracted kenṓ, fut. kenṓsō, from kenós (G2756), empty, void. To make empty, to empty, falsify, be fallacious.
(I) The antithesis of plēróō (G4137), to fill. Kenóō is used in Rom_4:14; 1Co_1:17; 1Co_9:15; 2Co_9:3; Php_2:7 meaning to empty oneself, to divest oneself of rightful dignity by descending to an inferior condition, to abase oneself.
(II) The use in Php_2:7 is of great theological importance. It refers to Jesus Christ as emptying Himself at the time of His incarnation, denoting the beginning of His self-humiliation in verse eight. In order to understand what is meant by Jesus' emptying Himself, the whole passage (Php_2:6-8) must be examined. Christ was in the form of God, did empty himself and became in the form of man. Christ was equal to God, did ampty himself and became in likeness of man.
No doubt that an emptying did hapens. Christ did empty from being equal to God, and Christ did ampty of being in form of God. The result was a Christ in likeness of man, no more in equality to God; and Christ in form of man, no more in form of God.
The total and absolute emptying of Christ is a real fact. Many false theologian have tried to denayed, but it did hapens in fact.
Php 2:6 who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped,
Php 2:7 but emptied Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men.
Php 2:8 Being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross.-NASB
Kenosis:
"κενόω
kenóō; contracted kenṓ, fut. kenṓsō, from kenós (G2756), empty, void. To make empty, to empty, falsify, be fallacious.
(I) The antithesis of plēróō (G4137), to fill. Kenóō is used in Rom_4:14; 1Co_1:17; 1Co_9:15; 2Co_9:3; Php_2:7 meaning to empty oneself, to divest oneself of rightful dignity by descending to an inferior condition, to abase oneself.
(II) The use in Php_2:7 is of great theological importance. It refers to Jesus Christ as emptying Himself at the time of His incarnation, denoting the beginning of His self-humiliation in verse eight. In order to understand what is meant by Jesus' emptying Himself, the whole passage (Php_2:6-8) must be examined. Christ was in the form of God, did empty himself and became in the form of man. Christ was equal to God, did ampty himself and became in likeness of man.
No doubt that an emptying did hapens. Christ did empty from being equal to God, and Christ did ampty of being in form of God. The result was a Christ in likeness of man, no more in equality to God; and Christ in form of man, no more in form of God.
The total and absolute emptying of Christ is a real fact. Many false theologian have tried to denayed, but it did hapens in fact.
0scar
New member
and Christ did empty, totally and absolutelly empty of being equal to God, totally and absolutelly emty of being in form of God.
OCTOBER23
New member
JAMIE ,
Joseph had to distance himself because he was a member of the Sanhedrin.
------------------------------------------------------
1010 βουλευτής bouleutes bool-yoo-tace’
from 1011; n m; { See TDNT 141 }
AV-counsellor 2; 2
1) a councillor, senator
2) a member of the Sanhedrin
---------------------------------------------------
Matthew 27:57 When the even was come, there came a rich man of Arimathaea,
named Joseph, who also himself was Jesus’ disciple:
Mark 15:43 Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
Luke 23:51 (The same had not consented to the counsel and deed of them
he was of Arimathaea, a city of the Jews: who also himself waited for the kingdom of God.
John 19:38 And after this Joseph of Arimathaea, being a disciple of Jesus, but secretly for fear of the Jews, besought Pilate that he might take away the body of Jesus: and Pilate gave him leave. He came therefore, and took the body of Jesus.
Joseph had to distance himself because he was a member of the Sanhedrin.
------------------------------------------------------
1010 βουλευτής bouleutes bool-yoo-tace’
from 1011; n m; { See TDNT 141 }
AV-counsellor 2; 2
1) a councillor, senator
2) a member of the Sanhedrin
---------------------------------------------------
Matthew 27:57 When the even was come, there came a rich man of Arimathaea,
named Joseph, who also himself was Jesus’ disciple:
Mark 15:43 Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
Luke 23:51 (The same had not consented to the counsel and deed of them
he was of Arimathaea, a city of the Jews: who also himself waited for the kingdom of God.John 19:38 And after this Joseph of Arimathaea, being a disciple of Jesus, but secretly for fear of the Jews, besought Pilate that he might take away the body of Jesus: and Pilate gave him leave. He came therefore, and took the body of Jesus.
0scar
New member
JAMIE ,
Joseph had to distance himself because he was a member of the Sanhedrin.
------------------------------------------------------
1010 βουλευτής bouleutes bool-yoo-tace’
from 1011; n m; { See TDNT 141 }
AV-counsellor 2; 2
1) a councillor, senator
2) a member of the Sanhedrin
---------------------------------------------------
Matthew 27:57 When the even was come, there came a rich man of Arimathaea,
named Joseph, who also himself was Jesus’ disciple:
Mark 15:43 Joseph of Arimathaea, an honourable counsellor, which also waited for the kingdom of God, came, and went in boldly unto Pilate, and craved the body of Jesus.
Luke 23:51 (The same had not consented to the counsel and deed of them
John 19:38 And after this Joseph of Arimathaea, being a disciple of Jesus, but secretly for fear of the Jews, besought Pilate that he might take away the body of Jesus: and Pilate gave him leave. He came therefore, and took the body of Jesus.
Jesus have one nature, not two as the most of the heressies teach. Jesus do not have a divine nature PLUS a human nature. That can not be found in any verse of the scripture. It is a human philosophy construction.
OCTOBER23
New member
OSCAR said,
Jesus had one nature, not two as the most of the churches teach. = RIGHT
Jesus did not have a divine nature PLUS a human nature. = RIGHT
That cannot be found in any verse of the scripture. = RIGHT
It is a human philosophy construction. = RIGHT
That is Right because JESUS had to be a HUMAN BEING in order to be a perfect human
example and build Godly human character to take back to the Father and later send
it down as the Comforter.
Jesus had one nature, not two as the most of the churches teach. = RIGHT
Jesus did not have a divine nature PLUS a human nature. = RIGHT
That cannot be found in any verse of the scripture. = RIGHT
It is a human philosophy construction. = RIGHT
That is Right because JESUS had to be a HUMAN BEING in order to be a perfect human
example and build Godly human character to take back to the Father and later send
it down as the Comforter.