Shalom.
No. I already know that. But from the Bible and Christian teaching. I am not English.
Shalom.
Jacob
Jesus Fulfilled The Old Testament Law
- Thread starter Squeaky
- Start date
Shalom.
No. I already know that. But from the Bible and Christian teaching. I am not English.
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
you idiot if you knew that you would have said that. You really are a pathological liar.
Shalom.
Incorrect. I shared what I learned later on in life, more recently, and something you weren't expecting I guess. Well, you need to accept all of nt scripture. Because without the verse that I shared you have false doctrine.
I am Torah Observant. I am Sabbath Observant. I am not Eric Liddell and I am not a King or Chancellor or anything else that is English. Reference the Classic Movie Chariots of Fire my favorite movie as a child. Thank God for Abrahams!
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
Your an idiot. You have become an enemy of Christians.
[Rom 11:28
28 Concerning the gospel [they are] enemies for your sake, but concerning the election [they are] beloved for the sake of the fathers.
Shalom.
I am not. People even still wanted to call me a Christian for my belief in Christ.
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
Who cares what people call you, I don't. That has nothing to do with our conversation. One cant be a Jew and a Christian at the same time. Your a double minded man.
[Rom 11:28
28 Concerning the gospel [they are] enemies for your sake, but concerning the election [they are] beloved for the sake of the fathers.
[Jas 1:7-8
7 For let not that man suppose that he will receive anything from the Lord;
8 [he is] a double-minded man, unstable in all his ways.
Shalom.
Yes. You are talking about wisdom. That is what my yes is about, from James. Let not many of you become teachers because you will incur a stricter judgment.
As for a Jew and a Christian at the same time, it was the Jews and the Greeks to whom the gospel was presented.
Romans 1:16 KJV - For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
Romans 1:17 KJV - For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.
The question I had was if those first called Christians (it is about Christ, from Messiah meaning Anointed) at Antioch were Jews, Jewish, as the early church was entirely Jewish. The Spirit was poured out on Gentiles as well.
Acts 11:26 KJV - And when he had found him, he brought him unto Antioch. And it came to pass, that a whole year they assembled themselves with the church, and taught much people. And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch.
It was the disciples that were first called Christians in Antioch, or rather who were called Christians first in Antioch.
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
The first Jews had to give up everything from the old testament. It wasn't automatic it took years as they learned. Paul was a Pharisee, not is a Pharisee. There were some Jews(Pharisees) that wouldn't be obedient. There going to hell. Like you trying to hold onto the old testament.
[Phl 3:5-9
5 circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, [of] the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of the Hebrews; concerning the law, a Pharisee;
6 concerning zeal, persecuting the church; concerning the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
7 But what things were gain to me, these I have counted loss for Christ.
8 Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish, that I may gain Christ
9 and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which [is] from the law, but that which [is] through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith;
Shalom.
Paul didn't cease being a Jew when he became a Christian.
2 Corinthians 11:26 KJV - [In] journeyings often, [in] perils of waters, [in] perils of robbers, [in] perils by [mine own] countrymen, [in] perils by the heathen, [in] perils in the city, [in] perils in the wilderness, [in] perils in the sea, [in] perils among false brethren;
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
Yes he did. He gave it all up for Christ.
[Phl 3:5-9
5 circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, [of] the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of the Hebrews; concerning the law, a Pharisee;
6 concerning zeal, persecuting the church; concerning the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
7 But what things were gain to me, these I have counted loss for Christ.
8 Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ
Shalom.
Certainly he was still a Jew, a Hebrew and of the tribe of Benjamin. A Pharisee. This never changed. What changed was that he was converted. He later became a Christian if he was in Antioch or taught others to become Christians.
Acts 19:34 KJV - But when they knew that he was a Jew, all with one voice about the space of two hours cried out, Great [is] Diana of the Ephesians.
Acts 21:39 KJV - But Paul said, I am a man [which am] a Jew of Tarsus, [a city] in Cilicia, a citizen of no mean city: and, I beseech thee, suffer me to speak unto the people.
Acts 22:3 KJV - I am verily a man [which am] a Jew, born in Tarsus, [a city] in Cilicia, yet brought up in this city at the feet of Gamaliel, [and] taught according to the perfect manner of the law of the fathers, and was zealous toward God, as ye all are this day.
1 Corinthians 9:20 KJV - And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;
Galatians 2:14 KJV - But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before [them] all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
Your an idiot. Context, context,,context. I don't think you can read the new testament in context. Paul said he only became a Jew to convert them over to Christianity. And he kept himself under the law of Christ.
[1Co 9:17-21
17 For if I do this willingly, I have a reward; but if against my will, I have been entrusted with a stewardship.
18 What is my reward then? That when I preach the gospel, I may present the gospel of Christ without charge, that I may not abuse my authority in the gospel.
19 For though I am free from all [men], I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win the more;
20 and to the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might win Jews; to those [who are] under the law, as under the law, that I might win those [who are] under the law;
21 to those [who are] without law, as without law (not being without law toward God, but under law toward Christ), that I might win those [who are] without law;
Shalom.
Of course read in context. Just don't leave anything out. He is not saying that he was not a Jew and became a Jew. He is saying that to Jews he was a Jew, he became a Jew, to win people (them) to Christ. He says that he was never without the law except when he was under the law toward Christ.
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
lololo No he was saying the Jews are blind and that he has to pacify while he converts them.
[Rom 11:25
25 For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
Shalom.
Paul is not talking about converting people away from the truth and Israel. He is talking about people being grafted in to the vine.
Shalom.
Jacob
I said
lol Use your head. The Jews have been blinded. You have been blinded.
xxx Jesus nailed the old testament to the cross. If you have nailed the old testament to your cross, you are in Christianity.
Jesus changed the priesthood,He changed the Law, He annulled the commandments, and He made the covenant obsolete.
Heb 7:11-12
11 Therefore, if perfection were through the Levitical priesthood (for under it the people received the law), what further need was there that another priest should rise according to the order of Melchizedek, and not be called according to the order of Aaron?
12 For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law.
(NKJ)
Heb 7:18
18 For on the one hand there is an annulling of the former commandment because of its weakness and unprofitableness,
(NKJ)
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
(NKJ)
Shalom.
Today is Chamishi, 12-21. From evening to morning. And from night to day.
The first believers were Jews. I also am a Jew.
What is meant by
Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new covenant," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
(NKJ)
?
He has made the first obsolete. And, Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. If He made the first obsolete, and He did, in what sense is it made obsolete? For, what is becoming obsolete..., etc....
There was a change of the law. But Jesus did not change the Law.
Hebrews 7:18 is not sufficiently explained.
I do not believe that the commandments have been annulled.
Also, a person does not become a Christian by nailing the Law to the cross. That is not instructed in the Bible, even the New Testament. It is a false Christian belief, a false doctrine, among some Christians and others. Those professing Christianity. Whether they truly are, or are truly or are in truth, Christians. Pardon me, you said the Old Testament. I understand this to mean the Law but your words are not the words of scripture about what was nailed to the cross.
I do not know that I have a cross that I am supposed to nail the Old Testament to. I do know that Jesus instructed me to take up my cross daily and follow after Him.
I do not know why you say to use my head. I also do not know why you say that anyone has been blinded.
Shalom.
Jacob
Obsolete is not useful anymore to a Christian.
[Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new [covenant]," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
[Rom 10:4
4 For Christ [is] the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
[Mat 27:51
51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split,
[Mar 15:38
38 Then the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom.
[Heb 8:7
7 For if that first [covenant] had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
[Heb 8:13
13 In that He says, "A new [covenant]," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.
[Rom 10:4
4 For Christ [is] the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.
[Mat 27:51
51 Then, behold, the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom; and the earth quaked, and the rocks were split,
[Mar 15:38
38 Then the veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom.
[Heb 8:7
7 For if that first [covenant] had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
I said
Well Duh! That is because you have carnal understanding and I have spiritual understanding.