If you aren't Catholic, you are not fully Christian

[Idolater]

Yes, but the "Lamb" alludes to the nation of Israel. Gentiles had no law nor sacrificial system given to them by God.

Yes, but if you try too hard to "be Israel" you will miss the blessings of the body of Christ (which is not associated with Israel).

It's Paul and not me who calls Christ "our Passover". Your argument appears to be with him and not with me.

Again you continue to use "the Church" as if there is one and only one such entity.

As you again continue to refuse to demonstrate that there's any other Church in the Bible, besides the famed "church in the wilderness", as if your position is strong. You continual proffer this "church in the wilderness" as if it's just one counterexample among many, but we haven't seen a single other case where "CHURCH" means anything other than the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.

 

[Leatherneck]

Basically none of those things are Catholic, so you're not missing any of those things by not being Catholic.

What you are missing, is the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist.

"...where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them", "...the Lord Jesus the same night in which he was betrayed took bread: And when he had given thanks ("Eucharist"), he brake it, and said, Take, eat: this is my body", "...he was known of them in breaking of bread...", "They devoted themselves to the apostles’ teaching and to the fellowship, to the breaking of bread and to prayer", and, "...the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread...."

The church are those who are in the body of Christ not a lying , contriving, idolatrous man made organization that preys on those they are supposed to Shepard for Jesus. The RCC perfectly fits what Jesus describes as a tomb all pretty and white on the outside but on the inside only rotting corpses with the smell of death. No thanks.

 

[Right Divider]

It's Paul and not me who calls Christ "our Passover". Your argument appears to be with him and not with me.

I have no problem with it.

As you again continue to refuse to demonstrate that there's any other Church in the Bible, besides the famed "church in the wilderness", as if your position is strong.

The simple FACT that the Bible mentions more then one "church" prove my point.

You continual proffer this "church in the wilderness" as if it's just one counterexample among many, but we haven't seen a single other case where "CHURCH" means anything other than the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.

The "church in the wilderness" is ISRAEL. There is ALSO "the church which is His body" (i.e., the body of Christ) which is NOT ISRAEL. That you cannot understand simple facts is a wonderful testimony to your RCC indoctrination.

 

[Idolater]

I have no problem with it.

The simple FACT that the Bible mentions more then one "church" prove my point.


The "church in the wilderness" is ISRAEL. There is ALSO "the church which is His body" (i.e., the body of Christ) which is NOT ISRAEL. That you cannot understand simple facts is a wonderful testimony to your RCC indoctrination.

We already know that the Body of Christ is the Church. We also know that the Church breaks bread together.

 

[Right Divider]

We already know that the Body of Christ is the Church.

The body of Christ is A church.
There are other churches in the Bible.
Israel is not the body of Christ and the body of Christ is not Israel.

We also know that the Church breaks bread together.

Misdirection.

 

[JudgeRightly]

Is the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world or not?

No, it's "The Book from the Foundation of the World of the Lamb Slain." Not how it's worded in English, but that is how it's meant in the greek. (@Right Divider)

 

[Idolater]

The body of Christ is A church.
There are other churches in the Bible.

There you go again! "There are other churches" you say! Show me just one other one besides the Church and Israel!

Israel is not the body of Christ and the body of Christ is not Israel.

I don't confuse them.

Misdirection.

Nope.

 

[Idolater]

No, it's "The Book from the Foundation of the World of the Lamb Slain." Not how it's worded in English, but that is how it's meant in the greek. (@Right Divider)

New Testament English translators are not unanimous.

Here is Revelation 13:8 in tons of different English translations.

Revelation 13:8 - Bible Gateway

www.biblegateway.com

"[the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world]" appears in many of them, including KJV, NIV and others, and there are many where it isn't rendered that way too. So it's controversial among New Testament translators.

 

[Right Divider]

There you go again! "There are other churches" you say! Show me just one other one besides the Church and Israel!

How many do you need?

I don't confuse them.

Of course you do. You attempt to follow one of the TWELVE apostles for the TWELVE tribes of ISRAEL.
Whereas you should be following the one apostle for the one body.

Nope.

Yep

 

[JudgeRightly]

New Testament English translators are not unanimous.

Duh. And yet, scripture itself is clear enough in any language to be able to discern its meaning.

Here is Revelation 13:8 in tons of different English translations.

Revelation 13:8 - Bible Gateway

www.biblegateway.com

I know what it says.

IT DOESN'T SAY that the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world.

"[the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world]" appears in many of them, including KJV, NIV and others, and there are many where it isn't rendered that way too. So it's controversial among New Testament translators.

You're omitting the most important part, and that is causing your confusion.

Don't leave out the book that's being talked about IN THAT VERY VERSE IMMEDIATELY PRIOR TO THAT PHRASE!

All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. - Revelation 13:8 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation13:8&version=NKJV

The title of the book is "The Book of Life."

It belongs to the Lamb who was slain.

Names have been written in it from the foundation of the world. Those people, whose names have not been written in the book from the foundation of the world, will worship the beast.

The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. - Revelation 17:8 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation17:8&version=NKJV

The title of the book is "the Book of Life."

Names have been written in the book from the foundation of the world, and those who have not had their name written in it will marvel at the beast.

And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. - Revelation 20:15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation20:15&version=NKJV

The title of the book: "The Book of Life."

Anyone who doesn't have their name in the book is cast into the lake of fire.

But there shall by no means enter it anything that defiles, or causes an abomination or a lie, but only those who are written in the Lamb’s Book of Life. - Revelation 21:27 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation21:27&version=NKJV

Again, the book, which belongs to the Lamb, is called the "Book of Life."

Names were written in it, and those whose names were written in it shall enter.

Do you get it yet?

Here's one more!

And I urge you also, true companion, help these women who labored with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and the rest of my fellow workers, whose names are in the Book of Life. - Philippians 4:3 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Philippians4:3&version=NKJV

The title of the book is "The Book of Life."

Paul's fellow workers' names were written in it.

In short:

The "Book of Life" contains names written in it. Those names have been added to the book since creation. "Since creation" is what the phrase "from the foundation of the world" means. The book belongs to the Lamb, who was slain for the sins of the world.

Scripture is NOT saying that Christ was being crucified since the beginning of creation, which is what it would mean if YOUR position were correct.

Clearly, that is not the case. CHRIST WAS NOT BEING SLAIN FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD.

 

[Idolater]

Duh. And yet, scripture itself is clear enough in any language to be able to discern its meaning.



I know what it says.

IT DOESN'T SAY that the Lamb was slain from the foundation of the world.



You're omitting the most important part, and that is causing your confusion.

Don't leave out the book that's being talked about IN THAT VERY VERSE IMMEDIATELY PRIOR TO THAT PHRASE!

All who dwell on the earth will worship him, whose names have not been written in the Book of Life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. - Revelation 13:8 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation13:8&version=NKJV

The title of the book is "The Book of Life."

It belongs to the Lamb who was slain.

Names have been written in it from the foundation of the world. Those people, whose names have not been written in the book from the foundation of the world, will worship the beast.

The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. - Revelation 17:8 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation17:8&version=NKJV

The title of the book is "the Book of Life."

Names have been written in the book from the foundation of the world, and those who have not had their name written in it will marvel at the beast.

And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. - Revelation 20:15 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation20:15&version=NKJV

The title of the book: "The Book of Life."

Anyone who doesn't have their name in the book is cast into the lake of fire.

But there shall by no means enter it anything that defiles, or causes an abomination or a lie, but only those who are written in the Lamb’s Book of Life. - Revelation 21:27 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation21:27&version=NKJV

Again, the book, which belongs to the Lamb, is called the "Book of Life."

Names were written in it, and those whose names were written in it shall enter.

Do you get it yet?

Here's one more!

And I urge you also, true companion, help these women who labored with me in the gospel, with Clement also, and the rest of my fellow workers, whose names are in the Book of Life. - Philippians 4:3 http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Philippians4:3&version=NKJV

The title of the book is "The Book of Life."

Paul's fellow workers' names were written in it.

In short:

The "Book of Life" contains names written in it. Those names have been added to the book since creation. "Since creation" is what the phrase "from the foundation of the world" means. The book belongs to the Lamb, who was slain for the sins of the world.

Scripture is NOT saying that Christ was being crucified since the beginning of creation, which is what it would mean if YOUR position were correct.

Clearly, that is not the case. CHRIST WAS NOT BEING SLAIN FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD.

So you're abandoning the King James Bible then. And Right Divider, you "liked" this comment. Do you approve JR's abandonment of the KJV /KJB /AV?

 

[Idolater]

Because if so, then I won the argument. It's over.

 

[Idolater]

The church are those who are in the body of Christ not a lying , contriving, idolatrous man made organization that preys on those they are supposed to Shepard for Jesus. The RCC perfectly fits what Jesus describes as a tomb all pretty and white on the outside but on the inside only rotting corpses with the smell of death. No thanks.

You're prejudiced over the fundamental attribution error and your complaints are all confirmation bias.

 

[Leatherneck]

You're prejudiced over the fundamental attribution error and your complaints are all confirmation bias.

Translated: I accept and believe scripture and not the lies, errors, and un-Godly traditions of the RCC

 

[Idolater]

Translated: I accept and believe scripture and not the lies, errors, and un-Godly traditions of the RCC

Nope. Don't go dragging the Scripture into this; it's all, you.

 

[Leatherneck]

Nope. Don't go dragging the Scripture into this; it's all, you.

Since when has any Roman Catholic placed scripture above their un-Godly traditions ?

 

[Idolater]

Since when has any Roman Catholic placed scripture above their un-Godly traditions ?

There are two categories of tradition, one is of man, and one is of God.

The Scripture records many divine traditions, that before they were written down, were traditions passed down by bishops, from bishop-to-bishop. The Gospels were all oral tradition before they were written down. All of the divine tradition originates in Christ, and was handed down to the Apostles, who handed them down to the first generation of bishops. Those bishops handed them down to new bishops, and this transmission and preservation process has continued ceaselessly to this day.

And one of those divine traditions, that comes from Christ, through the Apostles, is the office of a bishop (cf. 1st Timothy 3:1).

Protestants, who claim to hold Scripture in the highest regard in terms of authority, do not even follow the Scripture that tells the story of the Apostles establishing the pastorate that's always been known even up to this day, as bishops.

 

[JudgeRightly]

So you're abandoning the King James Bible then. And Right Divider, you "liked" this comment. Do you approve JR's abandonment of the KJV /KJB /AV?

I was never attached to it to begin with.

Again, the Bible IS NOT SAYING that Christ was being slain from the foundation of the world.

It's saying that names have been written in the Book of Life, which belongs to the Lamb slain, since creation. Can you acknowledge that fact?

 

[JudgeRightly]

Because if so, then I won the argument. It's over.

Are you trying to imply that I am rejecting scripture? When I clearly used scripture to prove my point?

Go read https://kgov.com/kjo.

 

[Right Divider]

So you're abandoning the King James Bible then. And Right Divider, you "liked" this comment. Do you approve JR's abandonment of the KJV /KJB /AV?

My "like" had nothing to with Bible versions.

P.S. If you want to make sure that I see your reference to me, make sure to use a proper tag. @Right Divider