Luther added the word "alone" to Romans 3:28 despite being warned not to do so.
How the Gospel Refutes Calvinism, Catholicism All Religions
- Thread starter Robert Pate
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Luther added the word "alone" to Romans 3:28 despite being warned not to do so.
Epoisses
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And no one has been able to topple him for 500 years.
To make a statement like that you would need to read his works, but you have already admitted that how haven't even read Bondgae of the Will. So once again you are shouting the odds on something you are not equipped of qualified to do.
Epoisses
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If there was one man who could topple him it would be John Bunyan who's books have outsold the bible. Also he was funny and entertaining not like some dry theologian.
jsanford108
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These are what you claim the verses say, however, the passages themselves do not allude to any of that.
Romans 4 is about grace. It says we are justified by faith, but that our faith is a grace in itself. As is our justification. It never a makes the declaration of "faith alone" salvation.
James is demonstrating that faith alone does not sustain a person, nor justify them.
By combing the two Scriptures, we get a much clearer doctrine. That faith saves us, and works sustain us. Because either of those alone is useless (James 2). Faith alone is dead. Works alone is dead. However, faith+works is much more biblical and scriptural (and logical) doctrine. It also makes sense when compared with Christ's teachings to "obey my commandments." Faith alone has no need for commandments or any actions whatsoever.
If any doctrine disagrees with a piece of Scripture, it is a faulty doctrine. Hence, faith alone and works alone being rejected for 1500 years after Christ's resurrection, until Luther declared it (an appropriate label of "man-made doctrine" is adequate).
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jsanford108
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Exactly. Thank you, Truster. And are we not warned against adding to, detracting from, or altering the Scriptures (Revelation explicitly mentions this)? So Luther, while pointing out hypocrisy (which was noble and good) acted as a hypocrite himself, forming a doctrine which was contrary to Scripture, and then twisting verses to fit his perversion.
I really do appreciate you making this point, Truster, as I feel that many Protestants do not know, or choose to ignore, this historical fact. I often feel that when I state this fact, it is dismissed as the invention of a Catholic. I really do wish to express my gratitude and to praise you for being historically accurate in this quote. Thank you.
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Epoisses
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What shall we say then that Abraham our father, as pertaining to the flesh, hath found? For if Abraham were justified by works, he hath whereof to glory; but not before God. For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness. Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Rom. 4:1-6
A faith without works is 'faith alone', unbeliever!
Give an example of Bunyan's being funny and entertaining.
Epoisses
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Everything is not about proof and example, dude! You need to get out more and mingle.
You've been caught out in another figment of your darkened imagination. As usual you try and twist the obvious and pass the blame on to me. FAIL.
Epoisses
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I guarantee you I have read more books by John Bunyan than anyone on this forum including you. He's my favorite author of all time. You're such a D.... A..
Big boast and so what? What did the saints do before Bunyan was born or Luther or any other of your idols.
Epoisses
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Do you need a hug?
Bard_the_Bowman
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A gift to the repentant sinner?
So repentance is necessary?
Doesn't repentance automatically put you outside of the faith alone camp? You seem to be saying that repentance has merit.
After all, what you are speaking about is faith and repentance.
And you acknowledge that "love" is required for works that justify and that God's love is given to those who repent.
I quite agree with you.
Faith/Belief is needed. Repentance is needed. Love is needed. But the Bible doesn't say any of those are "alone".
It is by God's grace that we are able to have faith, repent, love, etc. It can all be attributed to His grace.
If "faith alone" is such a key doctrine, I always wonder why Paul (or somebody) didn't just say so? I wonder why the Holy Spirit didn't inspire any author of Scripture to write that?
Let me ask you a quick question.
Can a person obtain salvation without having their sins forgiven?
Peace.
jsanford108
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Epoisses
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Just the ravings of a confused mind.
Epoisses
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Your faith is dead because your old man is still alive.
genuineoriginal
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Did Abraham act on his belief in what God told him or not?
Genesis 15:4-6 4 And, behold, the word of the Lord came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir. 5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be. 6 And he believed in the Lord; and he counted it to him for righteousness. |
Does doing the will of the father matter towards your salvation?
Matthew 21:28-31 28 But what think ye? A certain man had two sons; and he came to the first, and said, Son, go work to day in my vineyard. 29 He answered and said, I will not: but afterward he repented, and went. 30 And he came to the second, and said likewise. And he answered and said, I go, sir: and went not. 31 Whether of them twain did the will of his father? They say unto him, The first. Jesus saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That the publicans and the harlots go into the kingdom of God before you. |
Matthew 7:21 21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. |
Bard_the_Bowman
New member
Oh please. I was merely agreeing with your post #20 where you state:
You clearly state that "works that justify...are those produced by love..." which "is a gift to repentant sinners."
So in your own words you have shown that you are not in the "faith alone" camp.
You are in the "faith and repentance" camp.
If my agreeing with what you stated is the ravings of a confused mind...what does that say about your mind?
Why are you avoiding my one question to you?
Can a person obtain salvation without having their sins forgiven?
I would appreciate your answer.
Obviously, your response in post #37 is an attempt to bail out of this conversation.
I won't push it. If you want to answer my one question above, great.
If not, ok. Bail out will be complete and this conversation can be over.
Peace to you either way.