Hollywood pedophiles

Lon

Well-known member
Twice you misrepresent. The subcontext was about homosexuals, not pedophiles.
:nono: Pedophilia is exponentially problematic among homosexuals Defending a 'guy' in love, against God, is not a good trait. Love is no poor thing, but we do have to be wise or we love an abuser and thus hate the abused. I don't believe any homosexual in this thread was offended. In the long and short run, it is about one man's sensibilities about a term. If you called me a "cracker" or "chalk Asian" it is up to me whether I desire to be offended. While another may come in and think they are loving, they are somewhat a busybody. I am not a victim and choose to be nobody's punching bag. It is currently P.C. to be busybodies and march over another's business. Recognize the good and the bad of motives. Without wisdom, a good trait can become a bad one. A lot of violent marches likely started with some good intention or other.
 

annabenedetti

like marbles on glass

Family Research Council? I wouldn't consider that to be an acceptable source.

What About Claims That Scientific Research Proves Gay Men Are Likely To Molest Children?

Some conservative groups have argued that scientific research strongly supports their claims that homosexuality and pedophilia are linked. The Family Research Council has produced what is perhaps the most extensive attempt to document this claim. It is an article by Timothy J. Dailey titled Homosexuality and Child Abuse.
With 76 footnotes, many of them referring to papers in scientific journals, it appears at first glance to be a thorough and scholarly discussion of the issue. On further examination, however, its central argument – that "the evidence indicates that homosexual men molest boys at rates grossly disproportionate to the rates at which heterosexual men molest girls" – doesn't hold up.
In the following section, the main sources cited by Dailey and the FRC to support their claim are reviewed. The papers are listed in the same order in which they are first cited by the FRC article.

  1. Freund et al. (1989). Heterosexuality, homosexuality, and erotic age preference. Journal of Sex Research, 26, 107-117.This article is discussed above in the "Other Approaches" section. As the FRC concedes, it contradicts their argument. The abstract summarizes the authors' conclusion: "Findings indicate that homosexual males who preferred mature partners responded no more to male children than heterosexual males who preferred mature partners responded to female children."
  2. Silverthorne & Quinsey. (2000). Sexual partner age preferences of homosexual and heterosexual men and women. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 29, 67-76.The FRC cites this study to challenge the Freund et al. data (see the previous paper above). However, the methodologies were quite different. Freund and his colleagues used a sample that included sex offenders and they assessed sexual arousal with a physiological measure similar to that described below for the 1988 Marshall et al. study. Silverthorne and Quinsey used a sample of community volunteers who were asked to view pictures of human faces and use a 7-point scale to rate their sexual attractiveness. The apparent ages of the people portrayed in the pictures was originally estimated by Dr. Silverthorne to range from 15 to 50. However, a group of independent raters perceived the male faces to range in age from 18 to 58, and the female faces to range from 19 to 60.
    The article doesn't report the data in great detail (e.g., average ratings are depicted only in a graphic; the actual numbers aren't reported) and the authors provide contradictory information about the rating scale (they describe it as a 7-point scale but also say it ranged from 0 to 7, which constitutes an 8-point scale). In either case, it appears that none of the pictures was rated as "very sexually attractive" (a rating of 7). Rather, the highest average ratings were approximately 5.
    On average, gay men rated the 18-year old male faces the most attractive (average rating = about 5), with attractiveness ratings declining steadily for older faces. They rated the 58-year old male faces 2, on average. By contrast, heterosexual men rated the 25-year old female faces the most attractive (about 5), with the 18- and 28-year old female faces rated lower (between 2 and 3) and the 60-year old female faces rated the least attractive (about 1).
    A serious problem with this study is that the researchers didn't control for the possibility that some of the faces pictured in the photos might simply have been more or less physically attractive than the others, independent of their age or gender. The researchers explicitly acknowledged this shortcoming, speculating that the women's faces in the 25-year old group might have been more attractive than women's faces in the other age groups. But they didn't address the possibility that the attractiveness of the male and female faces may not have been comparable.
    This issue could have been addressed in various ways. For example, prior to collecting data, the researchers could have started with a large number of photographs and asked a group of independent raters to evaluate the general physical attractiveness of the face in each photo; these ratings could have been used to select photos for the experiment that were equivalent in attractiveness. Getting independent ratings of experimental stimuli in this way is a common procedure in social psychological research.
    Thus, even if one accepts the questionable assumption that this study is relevant, it doesn't support the FRC's contention that gay men are more likely than heterosexual men to be child molesters for several reasons:
    • the researchers failed to control for the varying attractiveness of the different photos;
    • all of the faces portrayed in the photos were perceived to be at least 18; and
    • the study merely assessed judgments of sexual attractiveness rather than the research participants' sexual arousal.
  3. Blanchard et al. (2000). Fraternal birth order and sexual orientation in pedophiles. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 29, 463-478.This study categorized convicted sex offenders according to whether they molested or reported sexual attraction to boys only, girls only, or both boys and girls. These groups were labeled, respectively, homosexual pedophiles, heterosexual pedophiles, and bisexual pedophiles. This classification referred to their attractions to children. Adult sexual orientation (or even whether the men had an adult sexual orientation) wasn't assessed.
  4. Elliott et al. (1995). Child sexual abuse prevention: What offenders tell us. Child Abuse & Neglect, 19, 579-594.In this study, child sex offenders were interviewed. Their sexual orientation (gay, heterosexual, bisexual) wasn't assessed. The authors drew from their findings to suggest strategies for how parents and children can prevent sexual victimization. It is noteworthy that none of those strategies involved avoiding gay men.
  5. Jenny et al. (1994). Are children at risk for sexual abuse by homosexuals? Pediatrics, 94, 41-44.This study, described above in the section on "Other Approaches," contradicts the FRC's argument. The FRC faults the study because the researchers didn't directly interview perpetrators but instead relied on the victims' medical charts for information about the offender's sexual orientation. However, other studies cited favorably by the FRC (and summarized in this section) similarly relied on chart data (Erickson et al., 1988) or did not directly assess the sexual orientation of perpetrators (Blanchard et al. 2000; Elliott et al. 1995; Marshall et al., 1988). Thus, the FRC apparently considers this method a weakness only when it leads to results they dislike.
  6. Marshall et al. (1988). Sexual offenders against male children: Sexual preference. Behaviour Research and Therapy, 26, 383-391.In this study, the researchers compared 21 men who had sexually molested a male under 16 years (and at least 5 years younger than themselves) to 18 unemployed men who were not known to have molested a child. Over a series of sessions, each man watched color slides of nude males and females of various ages and listened to audiotaped descriptions of both coercive and consensual sexual interactions between a man and a boy. During the sessions, each man sat in a private booth, where he was instructed to lower his trousers and underwear and attach a rubber tube to his penis. The tube detected any changes in penis circumference, with increases interpreted as indicating sexual arousal.
    The FRC cites this study as showing that "a homosexual and a heterosexual subgroup can be delineated among these offenders." This is true but hardly relevant to their claims.
    The researchers categorized 7 offenders who were more aroused overall by the male nudes than the female nudes as the homosexual subgroup. They categorized 14 offenders who were more aroused overall by the female nudes as the heterosexual subgroup. The offenders were not asked their sexual orientation (gay, straight, bisexual) and the paper does not report any information about the nature of the offenders' adult sexual relationships, or even if they had any such relationships.
  7. Bickley & Beech. (2001). Classifying child abusers: Its relevance to theory and clinical practice. International Journal Of Offender Therapy And Comparative Criminology, 45, 51-69.This is a literature review and theoretical paper that discusses the strengths and weaknesses of various systems for classifying child molesters. In citing this study, the FRC says it:
    refers to homosexual pedophiles as a "distinct group." The victims of homosexual pedophiles "were more likely to be strangers, that they were more likely to have engaged in paraphiliac behavior separate from that involved in the offence, and that they were more likely to have past convictions for sexual offences.... Other studies [showed a] greater risk of reoffending than those who had offended against girls" and that the "recidivism rate for male-victim offenders is approximately twice that for female-victim offenders."
    In reality, however, the paper was summarizing the findings of other studies, not reporting new data. In the passage excerpted by the FRC, the authors were discussing published papers that used a classification system focusing entirely on the sex of victims (not whether the perpetrator is straight or gay). Here is the complete text (the passages that FRC omitted are highlighted):
    "Grubin and Kennedy (1991) reported that when dividing sex offenders based simply on the sex of their victims, offenders against boys stood out as a distinct group. They noted that their victims were more likely to be strangers, that they were more likely to have engaged in paraphiliac behavior separate from that involved in the offence, and they were more likely to have past convictions for sexual offences. Other studies have employed the sex-of-victim approach in the prediction of future risk, with offenders who have sexually abused boys or both boys and girls reported as having more victims and being at greater risk of reoffending than those who had offended against girls only [bibliographic references omitted]. In the nondiagnostic remarks, DSM-IV (APA, 1994) claims that the recidivism rate for male-victim offenders is approximately twice that for female-victim offenders, and although not demonstrating such a marked difference, Furby, Weinrott, and Blackshaw (1989), in an extensive review of recidivism rates, found that reoffending was higher for male victim offenders. [¶] However, the sex-of-victim distinction has not been consistently found, and contrasting findings have been reported in studies that have demonstrated no differences in recidivism rates between the groups [bibliographic references omitted]. Furthermore, Abel, Becker, Murphy, and Flanagan (1981) found that those child molesters who offended against girls reported more than twice as many victims as those who had offended against boys, a finding contrary to the hypothesized outcome." (p. 56)
  8. Jay & Young. (1977). The gay report: Lesbians and gay men speak out about sexual experiences and lifestyles. New York: Summit.This book, published more than 30 years ago by a team of writer-activists, is not a scientific study. The authors' survey methodology is not reported in detail and, because it was a journalistic work, the survey was never subjected to scientific peer review.
  9. Erickson et al. (1988). Behavior patterns of child molesters. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 17, 77-86.This study was based on a retrospective review of the medical records of male sex offenders admitted to the Minnesota Security Hospital between 1975 and 1984. Apparently, 70% of the men abused girls, 26% abused boys, and 4% abused children of both sexes. (The paper is unclear in that it doesn't explain how perpetrators with multiple victims were counted.) The paper asserts in passing that "Eighty-six percent of offenders against males described themselves as homosexual or bisexual" (p. 83). However, no details are provided about how this information was ascertained, making it difficult to interpret or evaluate. Nor did the authors report the number of homosexual versus bisexual offenders, a distinction that the Groth and Birnbaum study (described above) indicates is relevant.
In summary, the scientific sources cited by the FRC report do not support their argument. Most of the studies they referenced did not even assess the sexual orientation of abusers. Two studies explicitly concluded that sexual orientation and child molestation are unrelated. Notably, the FRC failed to cite the 1978 study by Groth and Birnbaum, which also contradicted their argument. Only one study (Erickson et al., 1988) might be interpreted as supporting the FRC argument, and it failed to detail its measurement procedures and did not differentiate bisexual from homosexual offenders.
Do Any Studies Claim To Show That Homosexuals Are More Likely To Molest Children?One individual has claimed to have data that prove homosexuals to be child molesters at a higher rate than heterosexuals. That person is Paul Cameron. As detailed elsewhere on this site, Cameron's survey data are subject to so many methodological flaws as to be virtually meaningless. Even so, his assertions are sometimes quoted by antigay organizations in their attempts to link homosexuality with child sexual abuse.
In a 1985 article published in Psychological Reports, Cameron purported to review published data to answer the question, "Do those who commit homosexual acts disproportionately incorporate children into their sexual practices?" (p. 1227). He concluded that "at least one-third of the sexual attacks upon youth are homosexual" (p. 1228) and that "those who are bi- to homosexual are proportionately much more apt to molest youth" than are heterosexuals (p. 1231).
Cameron's claims hinge on the fallacious assumption that all male-male molestations are committed by homosexuals. Moreover, a careful reading of Cameron's paper reveals several false statements about the literature he claimed to have reviewed.
For example, he cited the Groth and Birnbaum (1978) study mentioned previously as evidencing a 3:2 ratio of "heterosexual" (i.e., female victim) to "homosexual" (i.e., male victim) molestations, and he noted that "54% of all the molestations in this study were performed by bisexual or homosexual practitioners" (p. 1231). However, Groth and Birnbaum reported that none of the men in their sample had an exclusively homosexual adult sexual orientation, and that noneof the 22 bisexual men were more attracted to adult males than to adult females. The "54%" statistic reported by Cameron doesn't appear anywhere in the Groth and Birnbaum (1978) article, nor does Cameron explain its derivation.
It is also noteworthy that, although Cameron assumed that the perpetrators of male-male molestations were all homosexual, he assumed that not all male-female molestations were committed by heterosexuals. He incorporated a "bisexual correction" into his data manipulations to increase further his estimate of the risk posed to children by homosexual/bisexual men.
In the latter half of his paper, Cameron considered whether "homosexual teachers have more frequent sexual interaction with their pupils" (p. 1231). Based on 30 instances of sexual contact between a teacher and pupil reported in ten different sources published between 1920 and 1982, Cameron concluded that "a pupil would appear about 90 times more likely to be sexually assaulted by a homosexual practitioner" (p.1232); the ratio rose to 100 times when Cameron added his bisexual correction.
This ratio is meaningless because no data were obtained concerning the actual sexual orientation of the teachers involved; as before, Cameron assumed that male-male contacts were perpetrated by homosexuals. Furthermore, Cameron's rationale for selecting particular sources appears to have been completely arbitrary. He described no systematic method for reviewing the literature, and apparently never reviewed the voluminous literature on the sexual development of children and adolescents. His final choice of sources appears to have slanted his findings toward what Cameron described as "the relative absence in the scientific literature of heterosexual teacher-pupil sexual events coupled with persistent, albeit infrequent, homosexual teacher-pupil sexual interactions" (p. 1232).
A subsequent paper by Cameron and others (Cameron, Proctor, Coburn, Forde, Larson, & Cameron, 1986) described data collected in a door-to-door survey in seven U.S. cities and towns, and generally repeated the conclusions reached in Cameron (1985). Even Cameron himself admitted that his conclusions in this study are "based upon small numbers of data points" (Cameron, 2005, p. 230). As before, male-male sexual assaults were referred to as "homosexual" molestations (e.g., Abstract, p.327) and the perpetrators' sexual orientation apparently was not assessed. This study also suffers from fatal methodological problems, which are detailed elsewhere on this site.
In yet another article published in Psychological Reports, Cameron claimed to have reviewed data about sexual abuse by foster parents in Illinois and found that 34% of the perpetrators had abused a foster child of their own sex, that is, female-female or male-male abuse (Cameron, 2005). Not only did Cameron again make the fallacious claim that all male-male molestations are committed by homosexuals, he also made the same claim about female-female molestations. Once again, he had no data about the actual sexual orientations of the molesters.
Cameron continues to produce reports that essentially repeat the same inaccurate claims. Perhaps one of the best indicators of his diminished credibility in this area is that his work was not even cited in the 2004 FRC report discussed in detail above.

Conclusion
The empirical research does not show that gay or bisexual men are any more likely than heterosexual men to molest children. This is not to argue that homosexual and bisexual men never molest children. But there is no scientific basis for asserting that they are more likely than heterosexual men to do so. And, as explained above, many child molesters cannot be characterized as having an adult sexual orientation at all; they are fixated on children.​
 

Grip Docility

New member
:nono: Pedophilia is exponentially problematic among homosexuals Defending a 'guy' in love, against God, is not a good trait. Love is no poor thing, but we do have to be wise or we love an abuser and thus hate the abused. I don't believe any homosexual in this thread was offended. In the long and short run, it is about one man's sensibilities about a term. If you called me a "cracker" or "chalk Asian" it is up to me whether I desire to be offended. While another may come in and think they are loving, they are somewhat a busybody. I am not a victim and choose to be nobody's punching bag. It is currently P.C. to be busybodies and march over another's business. Recognize the good and the bad of motives. Without wisdom, a good trait can become a bad one. A lot of violent marches likely started with some good intention or other.

A group of people that subjugate, marginalize and desire to eleminate another group of people have no positive will towards their target group. Pedophiles are criminals. They are not a group of people. Are they beyond redemption? Some are and some aren’t. Only God can make the call of who is who.

Homosexuals? If you say it’s a choice, then you are admitting you could enjoy gay activity. Personally, I couldn’t and wouldn’t. Why? Because I’m not gay.

You seem to be struggling to express that people shouldn’t be offended by words or language, but there is moral relativism in that angle. Aren’t there words that you believe shouldn’t be used? Are you suggesting that context and not verbiage is what matters?

This idea would be okay if you are willing to fully accept the consequences of your implication.

What you are really doing is defending the right to use negative terms that demean a group of people. You can chop this up and remix it on a 10 turntable mixing board, but it still remains a poor excuse to make fun of someone different than you.

Unless you’re gay. If you’re gay, you may have more sway on this topic. Are you a homosexual man that is saying you are not offended by the term faggot?

Do you mind if I refer to you as faggot from here on out, even if you’re straight?
 

meshak

BANNED
Banned
:doh: Read the book! If you do not know your Bible (including Paul, Jesus' chosen apostle), you do NOT know Jesus.

Whatever version of Jesus you know, It is 'your' version of Him unless all you know of Him is in your Bible and you read it. Your emoting afterwards means nothing. We don't get to make up our own personal Jesus. He is who He is. Learn to know Him and change yourself, not Him. :mmph:

thanks for your opinion.

good day.
 

Grip Docility

New member
It's not the 'terms' that demean them.

The side bar in Question is over use of the word faggot. All in favor of being referred to as faggot from here on out, please reply to this post with something along the lines of; “I’m okay with the new nickname faggot, from here on out”. Don’t worry. There could be faggot 1 - 1,000,000. There won’t be a shortage of faggots to meet your nickname needs.

I, personally, do not want to be called faggot.

Thank you

Moral relativism is real, and though words are merely sounds, they can cut deeper than a Ka-Bar that just got sharpened by a Navy Seal. Talk isn’t as cheap as people elude. If this wasn’t true, message boards and time spent on them would be worthless.

Do words matter? Proverbs 18:21
 

Grip Docility

New member
Again, it is not the 'term' that demeans them.
They would be just as filthy and disgusting no matter which term you call them ---- faggot, queer, homo, gay ................

Moses uses the word abomination. If you eat shrimp, per Leviticus 11:11 you are also an abomination. If we interchangeably use your word filthy, I am as filthy as a homosexual, per God, through Moses.

Do you eat shrimp too?
 

Grip Docility

New member
Romans 2:1-2 is pretty important, considering it follows Romans 1. While the word filthy is being cast around, it is wonderful to be in the presence of those that can cast stones.

John 8:7
Romans 5:8
1 John 1:8

Matthew 9:12 How many healthy people are here?
 

Lon

Well-known member
Conclusion
The empirical research does not show that gay or bisexual men are any more likely than heterosexual men to molest children. This is not to argue that homosexual and bisexual men never molest children. But there is no scientific basis for asserting that they are more likely than heterosexual men to do so. And, as explained above, many child molesters cannot be characterized as having an adult sexual orientation at all; they are fixated on children.
As much as anybody would like to sweep data under the rug, one in 3 homosexuals interviewed, is well beyond a statistical ability to sweep it under the rug. Look Hollywood thinks this is appropriate and sees nothing wrong with it. You just CAN'T sweep these things under the rug. We all see it. What we choose to do AND believe after such is up to us. I for one, am not willing to lie for any political agenda for just any acceptance of just anything. It is wrong. One day it will not be, but by then, it will be too late and you and I will be seen as complicit or standing firm against it. It is NOT okay. I care deeply more about this than about a name that may hurt another's feelings. I'm not a victim. Names mean very little to me. Rather, I want to be on record as being against things that harm other people. This isn't 'love' Anna. It is cannibalism. Anytime we use another person to satiate our 'own' appetites, we are NOT loving and we are not without excuse. It is time for Psychology to wake up. This is against everything humane we believe in. We are making excuses for things that are 'acceptable.' Well no, never as a psychologist, tell somebody cigarettes are okay. They can abuse them, but I'm not for psychology saying 'Its okay.' No, no it is not. You may do it, but it will never be okay to harm yourself or others and THIS is what psychology and humanity and spirituality are all about. Making up excuses and excusing behavior is an abuse politically and ceases to be an honorable profession. Many psychologists agree with me on this but are 'politically' silenced, one for her job. Sad but totally true. Don't believe propaganda, Anna. You and I are better than that. Keep your eyes open and keep away from political and media manipulation. Whatever the actual statistics are, lets you and I, at least, be very interested and concerned about what that actually is. I know, per fact, something on the psych side doesn't add up. I've seen it in many reports now. There are way too many stats that show somebody is politicized and doesn't care what the truth actually is. There is a 'hope' that has its blinders on, and imho is misplaced. I don't want money or grants, I want truth, even if no paper of mine ever gets published (would need the PhD but that's my drive anyway).
 

Lon

Well-known member
A group of people that subjugate, marginalize and desire to eleminate another group of people have no positive will towards their target group. Pedophiles are criminals. They are not a group of people. Are they beyond redemption? Some are and some aren’t. Only God can make the call of who is who.

Homosexuals? If you say it’s a choice, then you are admitting you could enjoy gay activity. Personally, I couldn’t and wouldn’t. Why? Because I’m not gay.
Hogwash. We are all 'sexual' but such is cannibalism UNLESS it is confined in God's intent. Some of it is worse than others as well lest we all become animals and cease to be imago deo (image of God). If all you are is an animal, then your sensibilities are that of an unthinking animal. Psalm 73:22 (David calling 'himself' a bad name). 2 Peter 2:12 Jude 1:10 (careful, very basal language name-calling, be warned before reading scripture, it ain't pretty). Ecclesiastes 3:18, because that is what they are? :think:

You seem to be struggling to express that people shouldn’t be offended by words or language, but there is moral relativism in that angle. Aren’t there words that you believe shouldn’t be used? Are you suggesting that context and not verbiage is what matters?
A dictionary word??? :noway: What in the dictionary, that is accurate to what I am or do, do you propose? "IF" I am offended by it, I 'could' stop doing it. Is that an option? Try it: call me a 'garbage eater.' Offensive yes? What if I don't do it? What if I stop? If not, if I choose to pig-it-up roll in the much, and return to my own vomit, then I deserve the term. Think more: Why is 'burnt log' offensive? I read my Bible. I'm called a 'bible-thumper.' Offensive? :nono: I ride a motorcycle. I'm called a biker. Offensive? :nono: If I sleep around with many women? Etc. etc. etc.

This idea would be okay if you are willing to fully accept the consequences of your implication.
"My" implications or yours? :think: Are you seeing clearly? You 'can' be a bad parent, but you can't legislate bad decisions for everyone. We all get to weigh the proposition and vote, at least in this country. Yes, call me a bible thumper, or a biker, or whatever I actually am. Call me a sinner if you desire, for surely I've hurt people. Difference??? I don't want to be a sinner. The other? Wants exactly what the name says. See the general picture here? :think:

What you are really doing is defending the right to use negative terms that demean a group of people.
You are attaching negative to it. Do I? Yes, but there is NOTHING you can call them that will NOT have that negative connotation. Now think of this: Why are you objecting if not to disassociate the actions from that person? They WANT to be known and accepted for the very thing you find offensive in the first place.

You can chop this up and remix it on a 10 turntable mixing board, but it still remains a poor excuse to make fun of someone different than you.
Um, no. If you are into eating garbage or returning to your own vomit, then you are called a trash-eater or the like. It doesn't matter whether I disdain such or not, that is 'what you are.' End of story.

Unless you’re gay.
Nobody is gay UNLESS you believe you are nothing but an animal. I don't. I believe in imago deo. Those who act and only think like animals will perish as 'brute beasts.' That's what scripture says. In a nutshell, you are defending brute beasts to 'be' brute beasts. This is not the gospel. The gospel is that you are made for God and must be redeemed by God to live very differently above and beyond your basal self. Go figure science is more interested with the lower common denominator of man. All that study, money, resources for what? To live according to the most basal functions of life ignoring they, you, I, were created in God's image, NOT to be identified in the flesh. It IS a shame to be called after any fleshly basal function. Scripture uses these offensive terms: Drunkard, basal, fleshly, beast, self-pleasing, heathen.

If you’re gay, you may have more sway on this topic.
You might as well say, "If you are a heathen, THEN you can use the term heathen, not until!!!" :dizzy: Sorry, you lose on this one.

Are you a homosexual man that is saying you are not offended by the term faggot?
I AM offended by 'sinner.' As I should be. What needs to change? The guy calling me that? :nono: How about 'brute beast?' :nono:

Do you mind if I refer to you as faggot from here on out, even if you’re straight?
No. There are a LOT of reasons why not and so the comparison falls short. I've been called a 'Calvinist" with derogatory denotations. Bother me? :nono: Why? Because I 'choose' this. I'm then called 'hateful.' Bother me? Sort of. It isn't true. It is derogatory BUT it says more about another's heart than mine. Anyone who accuses has to deal with their own hate and spite. I never report the names I've been called.

1) A good number of them are true, regarding my Calvinism, just not in the way they think. Their problem, not mine. They are the bullies in this scenario. I don't call them hateful names back. I pray for them.
2) Any names that are untrue are hurtful in the sense that they wrongly marginalize and are MEANT to marginalize and ostracize me but, in the end, I pray for them and hurt more for them. I'm a fairly good guy. If my 'Calvinism' is grounds for them to disassociate with me, that is 'their' problem and 'their' hate. God loves me, despite my 'Calvinistic problem.'

What about a thread like "MAD are mad!" Derogatory? Yep. Hurt? Some of them. Is it meant to? Yeah, but I'm surprised it does. If you believe you are following God, then your embrace of something you love about Him, is important. If you will, I wear my Calvinism derogatory like a badge for Him, because if they disdained and reviled Him, He assures me, I'll likewise be reviled. The key to 'faggot' isn't in the person calling the name, it is in the need of that individual to no longer be a 'brute beast' but a child of God, by identity. As long as they are identified as the other, they will struggle and feel the hurt of something they are doing that isn't what they were made for. Names only tend to hurt, if the subject of that name, is a truth about us that we are ashamed of. You might call me a "Calvinist" and what is in your head is nothing like what I'm thinking I am, by example. Clavinist? I like John Ratzenberger. The 'slam' behind the change loses its punch after that. Follow?
 

Grip Docility

New member
Hogwash. We are all 'sexual' but such is cannibalism UNLESS it is confined in God's intent. Some of it is worse than others as well lest we all become animals and cease to be imago deo (image of God). If all you are is an animal, then your sensibilities are that of an unthinking animal. Psalm 73:22 (David calling 'himself' a bad name). 2 Peter 2:12 Jude 1:10 (careful, very basal language name-calling, be warned before reading scripture, it ain't pretty). Ecclesiastes 3:18, because that is what they are? :think:


A dictionary word??? :noway: What in the dictionary, that is accurate to what I am or do, do you propose? "IF" I am offended by it, I 'could' stop doing it. Is that an option? Try it: call me a 'garbage eater.' Offensive yes? What if I don't do it? What if I stop? If not, if I choose to pig-it-up roll in the much, and return to my own vomit, then I deserve the term. Think more: Why is 'burnt log' offensive? I read my Bible. I'm called a 'bible-thumper.' Offensive? :nono: I ride a motorcycle. I'm called a biker. Offensive? :nono: If I sleep around with many women? Etc. etc. etc.


"My" implications or yours? :think: Are you seeing clearly? You 'can' be a bad parent, but you can't legislate bad decisions for everyone. We all get to weigh the proposition and vote, at least in this country. Yes, call me a bible thumper, or a biker, or whatever I actually am. Call me a sinner if you desire, for surely I've hurt people. Difference??? I don't want to be a sinner. The other? Wants exactly what the name says. See the general picture here? :think:


You are attaching negative to it. Do I? Yes, but there is NOTHING you can call them that will NOT have that negative connotation. Now think of this: Why are you objecting if not to disassociate the actions from that person? They WANT to be known and accepted for the very thing you find offensive in the first place.

Um, no. If you are into eating garbage or returning to your own vomit, then you are called a trash-eater or the like. It doesn't matter whether I disdain such or not, that is 'what you are.' End of story.

Nobody is gay UNLESS you believe you are nothing but an animal. I don't. I believe in imago deo. Those who act and only think like animals will perish as 'brute beasts.' That's what scripture says. In a nutshell, you are defending brute beasts to 'be' brute beasts. This is not the gospel. The gospel is that you are made for God and must be redeemed by God to live very differently above and beyond your basal self. Go figure science is more interested with the lower common denominator of man. All that study, money, resources for what? To live according to the most basal functions of life ignoring they, you, I, were created in God's image, NOT to be identified in the flesh. It IS a shame to be called after any fleshly basal function. Scripture uses these offensive terms: Drunkard, basal, fleshly, beast, self-pleasing, heathen.

You might as well say, "If you are a heathen, THEN you can use the term heathen, not until!!!" :dizzy: Sorry, you lose on this one.


I AM offended by 'sinner.' As I should be. What needs to change? [/yelllow] The guy calling me that? :nono: How about 'brute beast?' :nono:


No. There are a LOT of reasons why not and so the comparison falls short. I've been called a 'Calvinist" with derogatory denotations. Bother me? :nono: Why? Because I 'choose' this. I'm then called 'hateful.' Bother me? Sort of. It isn't true. It is derogatory BUT it says more about another's heart than mine. Anyone who accuses has to deal with their own hate and spite. I never report the names I've been called.

1) A good number of them are true, regarding my Calvinism, just not in the way they think. Their problem, not mine. They are the bullies in this scenario. I don't call them hateful names back. I pray for them.
2) Any names that are untrue are hurtful in the sense that they wrongly marginalize and are MEANT to marginalize and ostracize me but, in the end, I pray for them and hurt more for them. I'm a fairly good guy. If my 'Calvinism' is grounds for them to disassociate with me, that is 'their' problem and 'their' hate. God loves me, despite my 'Calvinistic problem.'

What about a thread like "MAD are mad!" Derogatory? Yep. Hurt? Some of them. Is it meant to? Yeah, but I'm surprised it does. If you believe you are following God, then your embrace of something you love about Him, is important. If you will, I wear my Calvinism derogatory like a badge for Him, because if they disdained and reviled Him, He assures me, I'll likewise be reviled. The key to 'faggot' isn't in the person calling the name, it is in the need of that individual to no longer be a 'brute beast' but a child of God, by identity. As long as they are identified as the other, they will struggle and feel the hurt of something they are doing that isn't what they were made for. Names only tend to hurt, if the subject of that name, is a truth about us that we are ashamed of. You might call me a "Calvinist" and what is in your head is nothing like what I'm thinking I am, by example. Clavinist? I like John Ratzenberger. The 'slam' behind the change loses its punch after that. Follow?


I highlighted the hidden points you illogically danced around. I don’t follow you. I didn’t see anything about Jesus Christ, mercy or forgiveness in your words.

I see you suggesting you can fix that you are a sinner by blind implication of the words “who should fix this”.

I see you claiming a theological faction that is condemned by Galatians 5 And is documented to cause Christian infighting and shirking your responsibilities for that by calling others bullies.

I see you avoiding the truth that you are as in need of Jesus as an actively gay man, every day of your life and you are equally sinful as an actively gay man every day of your life.

Romans 2:1-2 is pretty important, considering it follows Romans 1. While the word filthy is being cast around, it is wonderful to be in the presence of those that can cast stones.

John 8:7
Romans 5:8
1 John 1:8

Matthew 9:12 How many healthy people are here?
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
A group of people that subjugate, marginalize and desire to eleminate another group of people have no positive will towards their target group. Pedophiles are criminals. They are not a group of people. Are they beyond redemption? Some are and some aren’t. Only God can make the call of who is who.

You don't get to define what constitutes a "group".

Homosexuals? If you say it’s a choice, then you are admitting you could enjoy gay activity.

What kind of a wacko statement is that? :jawdrop:

I can say it's a choice to rape a goat, but I'd never say I would enjoy doing it.

You seem to be struggling to express that people shouldn’t be offended by words or language, but there is moral relativism in that angle. Aren’t there words that you believe shouldn’t be used? Are you suggesting that context and not verbiage is what matters?

What a ridiculous statement. He was not the one "struggling". It's you strugging to support your inane statements.

This idea would be okay if you are willing to fully accept the consequences of your implication.

What you are really doing is defending the right to use negative terms that demean a group of people. You can chop this up and remix it on a 10 turntable mixing board, but it still remains a poor excuse to make fun of someone different than you.

Always accusing others of doing what you do. I think they have a word for that. :think:

Unless you’re gay. If you’re gay, you may have more sway on this topic. Are you a homosexual man that is saying you are not offended by the term faggot?

Do you mind if I refer to you as faggot from here on out, even if you’re straight?

I don't need to be a thief to call someone a thief. You do understand that calling people names that apply to their doings is not the same as calling someone names that do not apply to them.....don't you? You are simply so desperate to defend you idiot statements that you can't keep from digging a deeper hole for yourself. Nothing new here.
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
The side bar in Question is over use of the word faggot. All in favor of being referred to as faggot from here on out, please reply to this post with something along the lines of; “I’m okay with the new nickname faggot, from here on out”. Don’t worry. There could be faggot 1 - 1,000,000. There won’t be a shortage of faggots to meet your nickname needs.

I, personally, do not want to be called faggot.

Thank you

Moral relativism is real, and though words are merely sounds, they can cut deeper than a Ka-Bar that just got sharpened by a Navy Seal. Talk isn’t as cheap as people elude. If this wasn’t true, message boards and time spent on them would be worthless.

Do words matter? Proverbs 18:21

Paul had no problem calling people what they were. Nor did Jesus. The charge of "moral relativism" goes to you, not those who speak the truth.

God forbid we should call people fornicators, drunkards, effeminate, abusers of themselves with mankind......

1 Corinthians 6:9-10
9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.​

If you're dumb enough to call straight people faggots, then you're the one with the problem. I know how much you love to lecture other people, but you're making a real fool of yourself. Seems to be your calling. :chuckle:
 

glorydaz

Well-known member
Moses uses the word abomination. If you eat shrimp, per Leviticus 11:11 you are also an abomination. If we interchangeably use your word filthy, I am as filthy as a homosexual, per God, through Moses.

Do you eat shrimp too?

Eating shrimp was not an abomination to God. The people were to consider it an abomination to them because it was unhealthy. If you're comparing shrimp to sexual perversion, you have a problem. I just call it grasping at straws.
 
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