ECT Hath God Cast Away His People?

Jerry Shugart

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
northwye said:
In Ephesians 2: 12 what the Gentiles who believe are made close to must be to the Commonwealth of Israel, the covenants of promise and God.
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That has already been answered. Why do you always just state your views and then just ignore those who demonstrate that your ideas are in error?

I suspect that you realize that you are unable to defend your ideas.
 
beloved57

beloved57

Well-known member
Jerry Shugart said:
The verses which follow show exactly how Gentiles are made nigh:

"For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby" (Eph.2:14-16).​

Both the Jews and the Gentiles are made nigh because both are members of the New Man, the Body of Christ.

And here is what we read about the New Man, the Body of Christ:
"And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him: Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all" (Col.3:10-11).​

We are made nigh when both are baptized into the Body of Christ. We are not msde nigh to the Commonwealth of Israel.
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Israel , the natural seed of Abraham, arent the Children of God Rom 9:8

That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

So, they must be the children of the devil ! 1 Jn 3:10

In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil:
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
beloved57 said:
Israel , the natural seed of Abraham, arent the Children of God Rom 9:8

That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

So, they must be the children of the devil ! 1 Jn 3:10

In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil:
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But Jerry is further mistaken because he is negating what Eph 2B-3A says. All the technical terms for citizenship, commonwealth, inheritance are there and are enjoyed by gentiles who believe.
 
Jerry Shugart

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
Interplanner said:
But Jerry is further mistaken because he is negating what Eph 2B-3A says.
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I have already addressed that and you did not even attempt to prove anything which I said is in error.

Where I grew up in west Texas we call people like you "all hat and no ranch."

You're a big talker and that's about all!
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Jerry Shugart said:
I have already addressed that and you did not even attempt to prove anything which I said is in error.

Where I grew up in west Texas we call people like you "all hat and no ranch."

You're a big talker and that's about all!
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All the technical terminology for inheritance, citizenship and fellowship are there in that passage. You are scared spitless and thoughtless.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
steko said:
Correct!
We are made 'nigh' to GOD, not made nigh to the commonwealth of Israel.

Israel once held a favored, privileged position 'nigh' to GOD. Gentiles could only come nigh to GOD through that nation by becoming proselytes. The nations/gentiles were far off from that favored position...the commonwealth.

Through the blood of Christ, people from all nations, including individual Jews with no priority, can become 'nigh' to GOD by faith.

Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

Paul's point is that 'now' we both have access(nigh) to the Father by one Spirit.

Eph 2:18 For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.



Paul is definitely not saying that both Jew and Gentile have access to the Father through the commonwealth of Israel.
That would go against all that Paul teaches concerning Israel as being blinded, set aside and in a fallen state.
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Totally wrong about the commonwealth. Cp Rom 15, too.

Totally wrong about the blindness. It is PARTIAL. To the end of time. So are Gentiles. The assumption of Judaism was that ALL of it would 'automatically' respond, but Paul shows that in the past and ongoing, it is PARTIAL, PARTIAL, PARTIAL. There is no automatic anything for any ethne. It is not set aside. Jews can be evangelistists. All people are in a "fallen" state and all can recieve the mercy in the Gospel, Rom 11:30.

You are basing everything on ethne or class or gender, which is like modern liberalism in general. Enjoy your company.
 
Jerry Shugart

Jerry Shugart

Well-known member
Interplanner said:
All the technical terminology for inheritance, citizenship and fellowship are there in that passage. You are scared spitless and thoughtless.
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That is ridiculous.The verses you conviently left out prove that we are made "nigh" when we are made members of the New Man, the Body of Christ:

"Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father" (Eph.2:15-18).​

We are made nigh with the Lord and with all the other believers when we are made members of the New Man, the Body of Christ. And in the New Man there is "neither Greek nor Jew" (Col.3:10-11) so your assertion that we are made citizens of the Commonwealth of Israel could not possibly be more ridiculous.

Imagine that! The Commonwealth of Israel where there are no Jews!
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Jerry Shugart said:
That is ridiculous.The verses you conviently left out prove that we are made "nigh" when we are made members of the New Man, the Body of Christ:

"Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace; And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby: And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh. For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father" (Eph.2:15-18).​

We are made nigh with the Lord and with all the other believers when we are made members of the New Man, the Body of Christ. And in the New Man there is "neither Greek nor Jew" (Col.3:10-11) so your assertion that we are made citizens of the Commonwealth of Israel could not possibly be more ridiculous.

Imagine that! The Commonwealth of Israel where there are no Jews!
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It doesn't mean no Jews; it means that the Jewish ID doesn't matter any more than Costa Rican, or New Zealand.

You have missed the intention of the passage completely.
 
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