Has the Church Replaced Israel ?

[Gary K]

Sounds like you've never actually read the Bible.

Go read https://kgov.com/nice for a taste of what the Bible says about God being "nice."

Actually I've spent decades studying it. Our points of view are so far apart mine is foreign to you. I don't see a need to go read a theologian as I never read theologians.. Why? Because the infinite HS can teach us more in a moment or two than than another person can teach us in a life time. Plus He is never wrong whereas sinful men are often wrong. So, I'll just keep on trusting God to teach me as I always pray and ask for the HS to guide me before I open God's word and study, and Jesus promised that the HS would lead us into all truth not just some truth mixed with some error.

 

[steko]

Actually I've spent decades studying it. Our points of view are so far apart mine is foreign to you. I don't see a need to go read a theologian as I never read theologians.. Why? Because the infinite HS can teach us more in a moment or two than than another person can teach us in a life time. Plus He is never wrong whereas sinful men are often wrong. So, I'll just keep on trusting God to teach me as I always pray and ask for the HS to guide me before I open God's word and study, and Jesus promised that the HS would lead us into all truth not just some truth mixed with some error.

Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

 

[JudgeRightly]

Actually I've spent decades studying it.

So did Bob Enyart (who wrote that article). What of it?

Studying the Bible and simply reading it are, arguably, two very different things.

Try sitting down and just reading it all the way through for once, not trying to figure out what it means, or what something refers to.

Just read it. Don't skip anything.

Our points of view are so far apart mine is foreign to you.

I understand your position far better than you understand mine, because I have an overview of what the Bible says in context.

I don't see a need to go read a theologian as I never read theologians.

I'm not asking you to go read a theologian.

I'm asking you to get a second opinion from someone who isn't you. ("By the mouth of two or three witnesses every word shall be established," one witness isn't enough)

All I'm asking you to do is actually consider your opponent's position, rather than rejecting it outright. In other words, be intellectually honest enough to challenge your own position.

Why? Because the infinite HS

Meaningless platitude.

can teach us more in a moment or two than than another person can teach us in a life time.

The Holy Spirit uses means to do so.

Have you ever considered that the Holy Spirit is trying to teach you using my posts as the means?

Plus He is never wrong whereas sinful men are often wrong.

Even broken clocks are right twice a day.

Supra.

So, I'll just keep on trusting God to teach me as I always pray and ask for the HS to guide me before I open God's word and study, and Jesus promised that the HS would lead us into all truth not just some truth mixed with some error.

And what's to say it's not just confirmation bias on your own part? Hm

Nicer than God | KGOV.com

kgov.com

Read it. The Holy Spirit might teach you something.

 

[Gary K]

Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

If I understand you correctly you're saying theologians are necessary. I disagree. Why go to sinful men who may or may not have sdurrendered their hearts to God when we can, so to speak, fo straight to the horses mouth and get pure truth?

Paul is speaking about those we know are converted and have surrendered themselves to God.

 

[Gary K]

So did Bob Enyart (who wrote that article). What of it?

Studying the Bible and simply reading it are, arguably, two very different things.

Try sitting down and just reading it all the way through for once, not trying to figure out what it means, or what something refers to.

Just read it. Don't skip anything.



I understand your position far better than you understand mine, because I have an overview of what the Bible says in context.



I'm not asking you to go read a theologian.

I'm asking you to get a second opinion from someone who isn't you. ("By the mouth of two or three witnesses every word shall be established," one witness isn't enough)

All I'm asking you to do is actually consider your opponent's position, rather than rejecting it outright. In other words, be intellectually honest enough to challenge your own position.



Meaningless platitude.



The Holy Spirit uses means to do so.

Have you ever considered that the Holy Spirit is trying to teach you using my posts as the means?



Even broken clocks are right twice a day.

Supra.



And what's to say it's not just confirmation bias on your own part? Hm

Nicer than God | KGOV.com

kgov.com

Read it. The Holy Spirit might teach you something.

I didn't say I've just read the Bible. I said I've studied the Bible for decades after asking for the guidance of the HS. Bob was a nice guy, but that doesn't mean he was inspired. I'll stick with what I've been doing for a long time. I'm far more comfortable trusting God than humans.

 

[Right Divider]

If I understand you correctly you're saying theologians are necessary. I disagree.

I'm not a big fan of "theologians" either, but I've learned much from some believers that have come before me. That is why steko showed you the verse about "teachers".

Why go to sinful men who may or may not have sdurrendered their hearts to God when we can, so to speak, fo straight to the horses mouth and get pure truth?

We can all make the claim that WE are the ones that get our information straight from God.

Paul is speaking about those we know are converted and have surrendered themselves to God.

How do we KNOW this?

 

[Right Divider]

I didn't say I've just read the Bible. I said I've studied the Bible for decades after asking for the guidance of the HS.

Again, we can ALL make claims like this. What makes you the great one?

Bob was a nice guy, but that doesn't mean he was inspired.

And neither are you.

I'll stick with what I've been doing for a long time.

Stubborn people never learn.

I'm far more comfortable trusting God than humans.

What a coincidence! Me too!

Sorry GK, you're going to need to make some arguments and not simply claim the high ground.

 

[Gary K]

Again, we can ALL make claims like this. What makes you the great one?

And neither are you.

Stubborn people never learn.

What a coincidence! Me too!

Sorry GK, you're going to need to make some arguments and not simply claim the high ground.

I'm comfortable where I'm at with my method of studying scripture. Sorry if you don't like it but I will continue to do what I've been doing for decades. Yes, I'm stubborn and when I find something that works. I stick with it.

Tell me, have any miracles happened in your life lately? The laptop I'm posting from is a miracle. I'm getting blind in my old age and I shorted out the motherboard attempting to disconnect the battery so I could reset my mistake in registering it. My wife and I prayed about it and God repaired it. That's one reason I'm comfortable with my study methods.

 

[Right Divider]

I'm comfortable where I'm at with my method of studying scripture.

What a coincidence! Me too!

Sorry if you don't like it but I will continue to do what I've been doing for decades.

What a coincidence! Me too!

Yes, I'm stubborn and when I find something that works. I stick with it.

What a coincidence! Me too!

 

[Gary K]

What a coincidence! Me too!

What a coincidence! Me too!

What a coincidence! Me too!

Good for you.

 

[Right Divider]

Good for you.

FYI, this is a discussion/debate forum GK.

You should actually try to make arguments and also listen to the arguments of others. Those arguments need to be logical and coherent.

Trying to claim that the Holy Spirit has lead you to truth while trying to deny others the same claim is dishonest and will get you called out.

If you're just here to push SDA doctrines, you're in the wrong place. If you're just here to push the typical falsehoods of "Churchianity", you're in the wrong place.

 

[Gary K]

FYI, this is a discussion/debate forum GK.

You should actually try to make arguments and also listen to the arguments of others. Those arguments need to be logical and coherent.

Trying to claim that the Holy Spirit has lead you to truth while trying to deny others the same claim is dishonest and will get you called out.

If you're just here to push SDA doctrines, you're in the wrong place. If you're just here to push the typical falsehoods of "Churchianity", you're in the wrong place.

Isn't that exactly what you're doing with your churchianity reference?

 

[Right Divider]

Ok.

Probably your best post to date.

 

[Gary K]

Probably your best post to date.

I just edited it. You need to read it again.

 

[Right Divider]

Isn't that exactly what you're doing with your churchianity reference?

No

 

[Gary K]

No

OK, but sure seems that way to me.

 

[Right Divider]

OK, but sure seems that way to me.

Please clarify.

 

[CabinetMaker]

You're a fool.


PRECISELY!!!


Christ didn't make those people into the God hating perverts they are, their own sin and their own hatred of God did that. It is the unbiblically nice Christian who is to blame for greasing his slide into depravity and perversion. His perversion wouldn't even have ever happened at all if not for nice, friendly, useful to Satan fools like yourself who think that murderers, rapists and homos are people to be treated with dignity and respect instead of hunted down, tried, convicted and executed.


I know of no Christian who has or has ever started any presentation of the gospel to anyone in that fashion. This is your own idiotic dream because you desire to be nicer than God, who absolutely does want them dead, by the way. It is foolish Christians like yourself that have the perverts of the world, and most everyone else as well, believing that they're perfectly normal people and that their behavior isn't killing people by the thousands and undermining the very fabric of civilized society itself.


"Those dirty perverts made Me sick too! Good riddance!"


No one actually witnesses like that.


NO! It isn't even close to being remotely possible. Have you even read the bible at all?


Yes, by treating sexual perverts like normal human beings so that they can spread disease physically and spread immorality and hatred of God spiritually. Maybe you and your pastor teaches that, but God's Word certainly does not.


Yes!


You think that because you're a fool who thinks God is too mean and that you need to teach Him how to really win the lost.

Try reading your bible through at least once before coming on a web forum and trying to look down your nose at me or anyone here. You're a fool who doesn't have the slightest idea what you're even talking about. Homosexuals are guilty of a capital crime. A CAPITAL CRIME, CabinetMaker! Not jay walking, not petty theft or mere assault. They are guilty of a crime on the order of murder and rape and incest and bestiality. Would you talk with a murderer as though they're just a normal person? Would you be nice and friendly with a man who rapes women and/or children? Would introduce them to your family and have them over for dinner and talk to them about Jesus over a nice hot piece of the apple pie that you had your wife bake for them?

The biblical Christian should have a three pronged approach to such criminals....

1. The Christian should advocate for the re-criminalization of all capital crimes, including murder, rape, incest, adultery, homosexuality, child molestation, and bestiality and for the swift, public and painful execution of anyone convicted of such crimes.​

​

2. The Christian should employ and encourage a strong social stigma of such behaviors whether they are criminalized or not.​

​

3. The Christian should stand ready to give an answer for the hope that is within them should these criminals, or anyone they're associated with, be found searching for such answers. (This is most likely to happen just before their execusion, by the way. So, the more the first two points are followed, the more effective point three will be.)​

​

Put in a single sentence, the principle that you fail to understand because you have next to no knowledge of the scriptures is....

The law is the great teacher, not you.

I Timothy 1:8 But we know that the law is good if one uses it lawfully, 9 knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 for fornicators, for sodomites, for kidnappers, for liars, for perjurers, and if there is any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine, 11 according to the glorious gospel of the blessed God which was committed to my trust.​

​

See also: Romans 1:18-32​

Clete

About what I would expect from you. Legalism.

 

[CabinetMaker]

Telling people the truth is not cruel. It may not be nice but it isn't cruel. Letting the pervert think he's not a pervert, that's cruel. That's the surest way to garrantee his eternal damnation that I can think of. Way to go!!!


Liar. This "hate the sin, not the sinner" stupidity is a principle reason our society is in the shape it's in. It is why there are tens of thousands of innocent people murdered every single year. It is principle reason why millions of children are molested every year, creating the next generation of homosexuals.


Terrific practice with people who aren't actively practicing a capital crime that is not only killing people by the thousands but aggressively erroding the society that has granted you the right to share your faith with anyone. A right that you, or your children, will one day lose and you'll have played your role in its loss.


You are a veritable fountain of meaningless clichés.

Maybe. It is also entirely possible that I see Christ’s message as one of forgiveness and hope rather than judgment on a legalistic system.

 

[Right Divider]

About what I would expect from you. Legalistic.

You are dense.