ECT Do we see two types of faith in scripture or one?

[andyc]

you're the one who said you're confused. and you said you wanted to know why, or something like that. that's why. but it may take 30 years to 'agree'.... G_d doesn't hurry you. He goes all the way to the inside that He Created and fixes things right.
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.
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(when He's allowed to)

No its something I've been meditating on, and I still am. No one can say that they understand faith completely, or they will understand God.

We are all still learning, even you.

 

[Nang]

This is something that I was meditating on yesterday............

What if faith is a human quality that is enhanced through our regeneration?
I really like this thought, it really witnesses with me.

Well, of course it is enjoyable to think that humans have godly qualities, but they do not. All human beings are fallen and totally corrupted and depraved; held in bondage to sin, death, and the devil.

Being born again from above is not an "enhancement." It is a resurrection!

Dead sinners are brought to new spiritual life by the power of God and gifted with faith to believe in Jesus Christ for righteousness and granted repentance from sin.

Homeless, fatherless sinners are adopted into God's royal family and given the right to call themselves sons of God.

Prior to these wonderful miracles, the sinner is vile and undeserving of any favor from God at all. He is faithless through and through.

There is nothing abiding in any sinner that is worthy of enhancement. The sinner MUST be changed. And regeneration accomplished by the Holy Spirit of Christ alone converts wicked men unto God's favor. John 3:3

We must give Him all the credit, thanksgiving, and glory for any exhibition of faith in the Savior that occurs in this sorry world.


Nang

 

[andyc]

Well, of course it is enjoyable to think that humans have godly qualities, but they do not. All human beings are fallen and totally corrupted and depraved; held in bondage to sin, death, and the devil.

Being born again from above is not an "enhancement." It is a resurrection!

Dead sinners are brought to new spiritual life by the power of God and gifted with faith to believe in Jesus Christ for righteousness and granted repentance from sin.

Homeless, fatherless sinners are adopted into God's royal family and given the right to call themselves sons of God.

Prior to these wonderful miracles, the sinner is vile and undeserving of any favor from God at all. He is faithless through and through.

There is nothing abiding in any sinner that is worthy of enhancement. The sinner MUST be changed. And regeneration accomplished by the Holy Spirit of Christ alone converts wicked men unto God's favor. John 3:3

We must give Him all the credit, thanksgiving, and glory for any exhibition of faith in the Savior that occurs in this sorry world.


Nang

I agree that humanity is corrupted in Adam, and that we have no way of inheriting the righteousness of God by any means other than by God's grace. So I agree that we are depraved compared to God, but we're not totally depraved compared to the devil. We still have the capacity to be good to a certain degree, but not enough to inherit eternal life. We are damaged goods in Adam, not destroyed.

 

[Nang]

I agree that humanity is corrupted in Adam, and that we have no way of inheriting the righteousness of God by any means other than by God's grace. So I agree that we are depraved compared to God, but we're not totally depraved compared to the devil. We still have the capacity to be good to a certain degree, but not enough to inherit eternal life. We are damaged goods in Adam, not destroyed.

If man is not as lost and wicked as the devil, why will he share the same fate as the devil? (Revelation 20:10-15)

With what capacity does a sinner, dead in his trespasses, work good? His spirit is separated from God, who alone is good.

We are far more than merely damaged; we are consigned to death and eternal destruction, which we cannot escape except by the grace and resurrection power of God.

There is no life, no faith, no good, and no hope for man apart from the Person of Jesus Christ.

Nang

 

[andyc]

If man is not as lost and wicked as the devil, why will he share the same fate as the devil? (Revelation 20:10-15)

Everyone is given the chance to seek God according to the various dispensations in history. Conscience, law, grace.

With what capacity does a sinner, dead in his trespasses, work good? His spirit is separated from God, who alone is good.

Good in regard to perfection that's true, but God dose not seek perfection in people. He provided a perfect sacrifice for the world.
During the time of the dispensation of conscience, people would be considered good or bad depending on whether or not they obeyed the moral voice of their conscience.

Rom 2:15 ......their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them

We are far more than merely damaged; we are consigned to death and eternal destruction, which we cannot escape except by the grace and resurrection power of God.

We're all consigned to physical death in Adam. If we are spiritually doomed in Adam, all babies would go to hell.

There is no life, no faith, no good, and no hope for man apart from the Person of Jesus Christ.

Amen.

 

[Nang]

Everyone is given the chance to seek God according to the various dispensations in history. Conscience, law, grace.

But none do. Romans 3:11

The curse of enmity against God prevents any man from seeking God, unless God first draws them to Himself. John 6:44

No man seeks God according to conscience (natural law) and no man is saved according to the formal Law. Man is only saved and enabled to seek God, by the grace of God.

Sola Gratia!

Good in regard to perfection that's true, but God dose not seek perfection in people. He provided a perfect sacrifice for the world.
During the time of the dispensation of conscience, people would be considered good or bad depending on whether or not they obeyed the moral voice of their conscience.

Rom 2:15 ......their conscience also bearing witness, and between themselves their thoughts accusing or else excusing them

Even if a man excuses his own conscience, he remains without excuse before God and will face judgment by God. Romans 2:16

We're all consigned to physical death in Adam. If we are spiritually doomed in Adam, all babies would go to hell.

This is the truth. All babies born are consigned to death and hell due to the original sin of Adam.

Thank God for His mercy and grace, who elects to save many babies from such a fate!

Are you a Roman Catholic, Andy?

Nang

 

[andyc]

This thread is quite old, but I'd like to use Abraham and Abram as an example of the limitations of man's faith, and the faith of God which does appear to be inspired by a word promised. Faith comes by hearing a word from God, but until that word gets down into our spirit man / heart, it seems to remain a hope.

God promises Abram that Sarah will bear him a son, and Abram believed God, and it was accredited to him for righteousness. And yet Abram listened to his wife and agreed to go into Hagar in order to bring about God's promise. This is intriguing because Abram seems to be ignoring the word of God in order to bring about the promise of God contrary to the word spoken to him. This means that Abram's faith, although commendable, was imperfect. Of itself it couldn't lead to Sarah conceiving.

And so God returns again and changes Abram's name to Abraham (father of many nations). This forces Abraham to hear the word spoken over him all the time. He considers the impossible situation in the natural, but he keeps hearing the word "father of many nations".
Eventually the conception of God's faith (calling those things which are not, as though they are) takes place in his heart. He now can do nothing but believe and expect, and have rest in his heart about it. God's faith.
The lesson for us is that we have to keep hearing the word, and confessing it until it id conceived in our hearts. Then we're gonna rest.