Hi all, - just responding to posts as I read them here...past the OP
Yes,...the video is from Brother Kel,....I've shared his videos on Trinity proof-texts here before as well, he also has a wonderful website resource being the pioneer of '
The Trinity Delusion' resource. - what is odd though is that in LA's original post, there is no video link,...but its in his post in your response to it. Did he delete it from his original post? Kinda odd.
I included the video earlier on Titus 2:5 with my commentary response to drbrumely in another thread here.
Again, I've stated that from my perspective that much of the Unitarian/Trinitarian debates that have taken up a good many years of church council deliberations (with more than a few head-aches along the way) are
mere 'cosmetics' and complications in terminology, metaphysics and
doctrinal preferencing.
Thats it folks. Well, there's more to it of course,...just
nuancing the statement to perk things up
I may address the OP here, since I'm friends with both daqq and EE,..which presents a curious 'tension' in the mix. As EE takes off his kids gloves,...I've always like daqq kept my
surgery gloves ON in exegesis, and maybe a tad bit eisegesis,...when needed
But then again, I'm all about
'expanding consciousness' and espousing a much more liberal and universal theology, but for the sake of our discussion here on the subject, am circumscribed within the parameters of a judeo-christian context, its terms.
I've had threads on both historical Unitarianism and Arianism so have some schooling in that area under my belt, so am equipped there with other augments to enhance the discussion. I in these sharing do espouse for the sake of 'creative dialogue',
a more Unitarian view, obvously.
Its just a 'view'. Its not a dogma. I try not to invest too much into it, except ever hone and sharpen my insight, understanding and knowledge of the subjects (relationally speaking), tempered with love and wisdom, since these religous values and principles rule at the end of the day, while only the pure in heart see God. So we have to be careful that our insistence and demand to
conceptualize or believe in a
certain way or assume one one point of view is somehow 'absolute', does not obscure or prevent our spirit to be sensitive to the Spirit, and be its fruit-bear...not its griever. It must be one of the gravest of sins to grieve the Spirit, and a much worse sin along the same lines
to grieve the spirit of your brother. This is in ancient scripture by the way in one of the earlier gospels, so I bring it up so we can re-evaluate in what 'spirit' we are addressing each other in, and what manner any accusations are being made. (remember the accuser of the brethren? Who is that?).
Yes, this is point blank...but I'd rather present these important sentiments up front, that we be fair stewards and respecters of one another as children of God, and servants in his kingdom, differences of opinion or Christology asides. Henceforth, love and wisdom must be our constant guides in the conduct of doctrine, and even much more in PRACTICE. It still stands that we will be judged
"according to our works". Your faith must be
demonstrated to show that is both 'real' and 'alive'. OR it is not. - and this is just the truth. Grin and bear it.
I ask an important question
here about
what is so wrong with an Arian view of God and Jesus? Really. I find the 'reasons' shared by trinitarians...so far to be unconvincing. For some its just "because I say so", or some other presuppostional doctrines held which precipitates or
requires Jesus to be God, and so on :idunno: - really,...I can love 'God' and approach him thru His Messiah, just as well....as a Unitarian. - I'm doing awesome
Whose protesting? well, only 'protestants' against Unitarianism...thats it. - its all conceptual belief contesting, merely intellectual. I still value and celebrate the 'God' in Jesus, Jesus revealing 'God' to us, absolutely. Jesus came in the flesh,....certainly. The Spirit bears witness with the blood and water (divinity infused with matter)....Jesus did come....and you dont need the added 1 John 5:7 (
Comma Johanneum) to still be a real Jesus lover
- really.
I'm only using the 'Arian' example because EE has expressly called it out specifically and apparently has generalized it as a broad 'catagory' in which he has lumped a good many of us
- daqq already corrected him about NOT being a true Arian, since there are a few things he does not agree with as held by traditional Arianism. I think it important to know the differences. So while some of COULD be put into an 'Arian' catagory, (do your homework before label pasting)...I think only a few might really qualify to believe exactly like Arius did, and there are sub-catgories and different forms of Arianism too. - for anyone who has studied the
Arian Controversy, knows the whole thing is a metaphysical guagmire - and so much over the Father and Son being of either 'like' substance,...or the 'same' substance....OR some variation thereof.
AT BEST,...daqq and some of us holding more unitarian views, would probably best be placed under the broader catagory of general 'Unitarian' (with variances individually). I frankly dont mind that, since I understand the term, its history and what it entails or might include. I recognize it as just a 'label', but a helpful one descriptionally speaking. Who we really are as children of God, is the offspring of DEITY. - Pure Spirit, even that seed of potential immortality in us,...transcends religious or finite descriptions,...its beyond words, but we must use words of course to communicate our approximations of such. However, the 'word' is not the 'thing' itself. Be mindful.
