Calvinism and the word "WORLD"

[God's Truth]

I could buy it. But Jesus was there to seek and save His people. That did include a number of people that had clearly turned away from God before He sought them (like the Samaritan woman) but it did not seem to include more than a couple of guys in the Temple leadership.

Jesus did NOT come for the Samaritan woman, yet.

2) The notion that man rejects and runs from God is hardly exclusive to the Gospels in the Bible. Everyone turns and goes their own way and "no one seeks God." That's why Ezek36:26-27 shows that God is not limited by hard hearted men because He can change them. "I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes..."

You misunderstand Ezekiel. You misunderstand about no one seeking God! You are speaking as a Calvinist and not as one knowledgeable in the truth.

Paul is quoting King David. Paul is explaining that the Jews were sinful too. What is King David saying where Paul quotes? Listen carefully; at that time in which David speaks, the people are in a bad condition inside Israel. When the day spoken of arrived, no one searched for God.
If no one ever searched for God, ever, then how was it that the Israelites called out to God to help them when they thought God had forgotten them while they were slaves in Egypt?

Exodus 3:9 And now the cry of the Israelites has reached me, and I have seen the way the Egyptians are oppressing them.

Deuteronomy 26:7
Then we cried out to the LORD, the God of our ancestors, and the LORD heard our voice and saw our misery, toil and oppression.

If no one ever searched for God, then why do the scriptures say people did?
In the New Testament, when Jesus arrived, people shouted: “Son of David, have mercy on me”. They were looking for the Messiah. In the New Testament a blind man was searching for the Son of God, the prophet’s had said would come. I just showed you that people do search for God. Again, Paul was explaining that the Jews were sinners like the Gentiles, even though the Jews were supposed to be God’s Holy people.

 

[Potter's Clay]

In order to properly identify what God means by the use of the word "world", we must look at the context. In John 15:19, we see that the "world" is described as sinful. We know that God hates sin. If I need to explain that, I do not mind, but at this time, I'm going to pretend as if that is common knowledge. In John 3:16, we see that God loves the "world." If we look at these two verses in the same manner, we could not conclude that "world" has the same meaning. Therefore, the "world" in John 3:16 is referring to God's elect, which is consistent with Romans 9.


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[Robert Pate]

In order to properly identify what God means by the use of the word "world", we must look at the context. In John 15:19, we see that the "world" is described as sinful. We know that God hates sin. If I need to explain that, I do not mind, but at this time, I'm going to pretend as if that is common knowledge. In John 3:16, we see that God loves the "world." If we look at these two verses in the same manner, we could not conclude that "world" has the same meaning. Therefore, the "world" in John 3:16 is referring to God's elect, which is consistent with Romans 9.


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Dream on. God's elect are those that have come to Christ by hearing and believing the Gospel, Galatians 3:2. Which probably leaves you out.

 

[God's Truth]

Heck, it goes all the way back to Genesis:

Gen6:5 Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

That's a pretty rough assessment of post-fall humanity and Gen8:21 reaffirms this is still true after the
Flood ("the imagination of man’s heart is evil from his youth.") Noah had faith (which like ours, must have been given by God) but still the first thing he does after surviving God's judgment is plant a vineyard so he can drink to excess...

Jer17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, And desperately wicked; Who can know it?

You know Calvin’s doctrines but you don’t know God’s Truth.

See the heart is deceitful above all things does NOT mean everyone’s heart is so deceitful, it means among all the deceitful things in this world---the human heart beats them all out.

Jer13:23 Can the Ethiopian change his skin or the leopard its spots? Then may you also do good who are accustomed to do evil.

Listen to that scripture more carefully. That scripture is about people who are ACCUSTOMED to doing evil. Not everyone is accustomed to doing evil.

If everyone's heart is only evil then what is God doing searching it?

John 4:23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in the Spirit and in truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.

Jeremiah 17:10 "I the LORD search the heart and examine the mind, to reward each person according to their conduct, according to what their deeds deserve."

Acts 1:24 Then they prayed, "Lord, you know everyone's heart. Show us which of these two you have chosen

Revelation 2:23 I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds.


1 Kings 8:39 then hear from heaven, your dwelling place. Forgive and act; deal with everyone according to all they do, since you know their hearts (for you alone know every human heart),

1 Chronicles 28:9 "And you, my son Solomon, acknowledge the God of your father, and serve him with wholehearted devotion and with a willing mind, for the LORD searches every heart and understands every desire and every thought. If you seek him, he will be found by you; but if you forsake him, he will reject you forever.

Psalm 44:21 would not God have discovered it, since he knows the secrets of the heart?

Psalm 139:23 Search me, God, and know my heart; test me and know my anxious thoughts.

Proverbs 17:3 The crucible for silver and the furnace for gold, but the LORD tests the heart.

Jeremiah 11:20 But you, LORD Almighty, who judge righteously and test the heart and mind, let me see your vengeance on them, for to you I have committed my cause.

 

[God's Truth]

So it's no wonder that Jesus arrives with this Up-With-People slogan:

Matt19:17 So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God."

Jesus is explaining that goodness comes from God.

Afterwards, Paul keeps teaching that people without the Spirit can't come to Jesus.

Rom8:5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh...6 For to be carnally minded is death...7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

They can’t come to God because they do NOT want to because they only want to please their flesh.

1Cor2:14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

We are flesh and spirit. The man who only wants to please his flesh is about a natural man who only wants to sin.

In 1Cor1, Paul teaches that "those who are called"/"those who are being saved" (v24,18) can hear the message just fine but for others the gospel appears to be nothing but foolishness. God keeps inserting Himself in the narrative - Lydia believes but seems to need Him to open her heart first, some gentiles believe but only those who were appointed to eternal life. (Acts13:48)

Jesus only opened her heart BECAUSE she believed in God and obeyed Him.

The NT keeps telling you not to boast. You seem to think it's just a matter of politeness, since you clearly made the smarter, more spiritual choice than the unbeliever next door...but what if you literally don't deserve the credit?

It is never ever shameful to obey Jesus.
Paul says we can boast in our obedience. He boasts in our obedience and even his own, want the scriptures?
The no boasting is about the Jews being the ones who can boast in circumcising themselves and sacrificing animals, etc. They boasted in cleaning themselves with the purification/ceremonial works.

 

[Robert Pate]

You are intertwining the time when Jesus came with the time after Jesus ascended into heaven.

And what is wrong with that?

 

[God's Truth]

And what is wrong with that?

Because when Jesus walked the earth, he ONLY CAME FOR THE JEWS who ALREADY belonged to God.

When Jesus was crucified, then all could come to him to be saved.

 

[Robert Pate]

Because when Jesus walked the earth, he ONLY CAME FOR THE JEWS who ALREADY belonged to God.

When Jesus was crucified, then all could come to him to be saved.

The scripture says that... "God so loved the world" John 3:16. Jesus is the international savior.

 

[Potter's Clay]

Dream on. God's elect are those that have come to Christ by hearing and believing the Gospel, Galatians 3:2. Which probably leaves you out.

I would be interested in how a person dead in trespasses and sins could overcome this dreadful state unless God solely regenerated a sinner's heart.


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[Epoisses]

I would be interested in how a person dead in trespasses and sins could overcome this dreadful state unless God solely regenerated a sinner's heart.


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The Holy Spirit has been sent into the world to convict all men of sin, righteousness and a judgment to come. So while men are dead in trespasses and sin they are enabled by God to respond to the call of the gospel. Those that resist and reject truth like you are without excuse.

 

[Potter's Clay]

The Holy Spirit has been sent into the world to convict all men of sin, righteousness and a judgment to come. So while men are dead in trespasses and sin they are enabled by God to respond to the call of the gospel. Those that resist and reject truth like you are without excuse.

According to your interpretation, salvation is partly due to yourself.


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[Ask Mr. Religion]

I would be interested in how a person dead in trespasses and sins could overcome this dreadful state unless God solely regenerated a sinner's heart.

Robert's answer:

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...-Your-Savior&p=4849389&viewfull=1#post4849389

Sigh.

AMR

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

In order to properly identify what God means by the use of the word "world", we must look at the context. In John 15:19, we see that the "world" is described as sinful. We know that God hates sin. If I need to explain that, I do not mind, but at this time, I'm going to pretend as if that is common knowledge. In John 3:16, we see that God loves the "world." If we look at these two verses in the same manner, we could not conclude that "world" has the same meaning. Therefore, the "world" in John 3:16 is referring to God's elect, which is consistent with Romans 9.

Some never will come to a full understanding:

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...n-s-Nazi-God&p=4920136&viewfull=1#post4920136

AMR

 

[Potter's Clay]

Some never will come to a full understanding:

http://theologyonline.com/showthrea...n-s-Nazi-God&p=4920136&viewfull=1#post4920136

AMR

Sadly, man-centered theology that focuses on man's empowerment is becoming more and more popular. There was a time in America that reformed theology was flourishing. Now, Osteen's "doctrine" is growing.


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[God's Truth]

The scripture says that... "God so loved the world" John 3:16. Jesus is the international savior.

Jesus came first for the Jews who already belonged to God by faith.

 

[God's Truth]

I would be interested in how a person dead in trespasses and sins could overcome this dreadful state unless God solely regenerated a sinner's heart.


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Robert Pate does teach falseness, but so do you.

You know John Calvin's teachings, but you don't know God's Truth.

Those dead in their sins were the Gentiles who did not purify themselves the way the Jews did.

Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,

That means Jesus did not make them get circumcised before he saved them.

 

[Potter's Clay]

Robert Pate does teach falseness, but so do you.

You know John Calvin's teachings, but you don't know God's Truth.

Those dead in their sins were the Gentiles who did not purify themselves the way the Jews did.

Colossians 2:13 When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins,

That means Jesus did not make them get circumcised before he saved them.

If you are suggesting that Colossians 2:13 should be interpreted to mean that salvation is achieved by the performance of "X", then that would contradict Ephesians 2:8-9.


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[God's Truth]

If you are suggesting that Colossians 2:13 should be interpreted to mean that salvation is achieved by the performance of "X", then that would contradict Ephesians 2:8-9.


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The works Paul is speaking of that we do not have to do are the purification/ceremonial works, i.e. circumcision.

 

[steko]

The works Paul is speaking of that we do not have to do are the purification/ceremonial works, i.e. circumcision.

We 'gentiles' never did.

 

[God's Truth]

We 'gentiles' never did.

That is why we were WITHOUT God in the world.

See Ephesians 2:12.