Unsettled Deism is a disease of the mind, proven by the likes of Philetus, patman, Apologetic Jedi and other who are unable to connect the dots, jump to erroneous conclusions, and embarrass themselves in the process. Debunking and discrediting their non sequitur criticisms like shooting fish in a barrel with an RPG.
To Philetus
Philetus said:
That is really it in a nutshell, isn't it Jim. God loves Jim ... not everybody.
No, in a nutshell it's this: God's love really accomplishes the salvation of the elect. It really does. Those who have been chosen, regenerated, given the gift of faith and changed by God can experience the assurance and confidence of trusting in a God whose love actually does something. Open Deists want the whole world to be saved, contrary to God's word. Jesus' sacrifice only saves those given to Him by the Father, and He will not lose a single one. Each and every person God loves will be inexorably saved. This is a God worthy of trust. Not the Sand God of Unsettled Deism who loves everyone and loses the vast majority of them.
Philetus said:
Just special, elected Jim. Because if God loved everybody there would be nothing special about Jim.
Are you even trying, Philetus? How old are you? Nothing is special about the elect in and of themselves. What's special is not us, but God's love. If God's sacrificial love applies to anyone in hell, then His love is cheap, useless, and purposeless. It's no wonder that you people have yet to offer a rational basis for trusting Him.
Philetus said:
... And God loves Jim so much that Jim doesn’t have to repent or respond or behave in anyway different from anyone else.
What are you talking about? :kookoo:
Philetus said:
I was wrong about you. You are a little child; a spoiled brat that thinks he is an only child.
No I'm not! No I'm not! I'm going to tell my mom on you, you big meanie. Mommyyyyyyyy!
Philetus said:
... Your view isn't about God's immutability or love no matter how much you harp on it.
You're right. It's really about guacamole. I am crazy about guacamole, especially with those really big tortilla chips. Have you tried this? It's to die for.
Philetus said:
The only thing your view preservers is your own imagined specialness and pretentious immutability.
Pretentious immutability? What the heck is that? Dude, have a dictionary handy if you're going to try to use big-people words.
Philetus said:
... Your view isn't to preserve God's holiness and righteousness. It's all about Jim and how special Jim is compared to everybody else.
That part is true. I have such a low self-esteem that I've chosen a theology that makes me look better than everyone else. But if I'm so special, why do I have negative reputation points in the tens of thousands? Something's not working.
Philetus said:
Why would God need to change his actions if He decreed what the human race had become?
You just don't get it, Philetus. You apparently refuse to get it, because it's not rocket science. I'll explain it again. Try to keep up this time. Maybe take some notes. Here goes: If God decreed the future (are you still with me?), then whatever actions or change of actions God takes in that decreed future (are you following so far?) are decreed as well. Did you get that, Philetus. Let me say it again: If God decreed the future, then whatever actions or change of actions God takes in that decreed future are decreed as well. Do you understand? You don't have to agree of accept, just try to understand it so you don't look like such a bone-headed dolt when you comment on it. Please keep in mind, Philetus, that it won't cause your brain to explode and it won't send you to hell just to acknowledge the opposing view. To understand my view doesn't mean you accept it. I'm not asking you to accept it. But can you at least acknowledge and process the explanation? Maybe, just maybe, if you shut your maggot-infested pie-hole long enough and put to good use what little is left of your Openness-tumor-ridden brain, you might actually form a coherent thought that has a modicum of relevance to the conversation.
Philetus said:
If I thought for one second that you had any idea what you were talking about, I might take a statement like that to heart. But you're so clueless, it is obviously only an expression of typical Open-View desperation.
To Patman
patman said:
I am still bugged at your ridicule of your brothers and sisters...
I don't ridicule my brothers and sisters.
patman said:
For someone who calls God the author of sin, I'd expect you pluck the plank of wood from your own eye before you go digging specks of dust in others eyes.
Has anyone ever wondered why it is that every post by an Open Deist is riddled with this kind of sloppy thinking? It's because Open Deism affects the function of the mind. Open Deists are so mentally diseased that they can't even follow a simple line of reasoning. Check this out: According to patman, calling God the author of sin is the same as having a plank in one's eye, and then he expects me to agree with that and to remove the plank. Hellooooo. Calling God the author of sin is not sinful. Knowing that God works all things, even the sin and evil, for His good purposes, affirms that the sin and evil He authored is for good. It is saying that God decrees evil for good, just as Job believed, just as Joseph believed, just as Paul believed. So why should I remove that "plank" from my beliefs before I go "digging specks of dust in other's eyes"? Clue. Less.
patman said:
You are just poking eyes out.... You are a good object lesson for this.
What patman calls an object lesson for planks and specks has actually turned out to be yet another example of the theological Mad Cow Disease that is Open Deism.
To Apologetic Padawan
arbitrary adjective based on random choice or personal whim, rather than any reason or system : • (of power or a ruling body) unrestrained and autocratic in the use of authority.
apologetic jedi said:
['Arbitrary' is] a bad word when it pertains to those that make decisions.
Not for God. His arbitrary decisions reflect His essential character, and therefore we can trust that God only decreed that which works toward the ultimate good of those He loves.
apologetic jedi said:
... It shows an instability and unreliability in their mental state.
Note how consistently the existentialism pervades the Open View mind. The Open Deist has no concept of God's essence, only His behavior, which they judge according to their humanistic "Man-Is-The-Measure-Of-All-Things" standards. That is why they call God's meticulous control of the universe being a "control freak." They take the hangups and perversions of man and apply them to God. It's the same with arbitrariness. The Open Deist will not allow God to be arbitrary and to have unrestrained prerogative because they themselves cannot be that way without abusing or perverting that prerogative. The bottom line is that they want to control God, to bring Him down and raise man up.
apologetic jedi said:
Sure, it's not a bad word for the animals ... but as we get into free will creatures it is a wicked and perverse thing to be arbitrary as far as we know.
See what I mean? We should take comfort in God's total unrestrained authority. Open Deists are afraid of the idea, and for good reason: Their God cannot be trusted.
apologetic jedi said:
Even you admit that being arbitrary for humans has a bad connotation, yet you affirm that it's okay for deities?
Amazing. I doubt that Apologetic Jedi sees the admission he just made. I've been saying all along that Open Deists want to bring God down and raise man up. They want there to be as little difference between man and God as possible. So what does AJ do? He tacitly admits this by asking the above question, betraying the assumption that God and man are not all that different. Since man is wont to abuse authority and cannot be trusted to be arbitrary, neither can God. If AJ understood God's essential nature and character, he could take comfort in God's arbitrary decrees, and realize that it's not only OK for God to be arbitrary, it is necessary.
apologetic jedi said:
Since we all know that you have no frame of reference for deity other than relatable concepts you see through your humanity, we all realize you are just blowing hot air here.
Um ... what?
Hilston wrote previously:
God can be completely arbitrary and righteous. It's His prerogative.
apologetic jedi said:
Oh really?
So if God decided to love Satan that would be righteous? (because it would certainly be arbitrary!)
This is the cruelty of the Open Deism disease. The one with the diseased mind is oblivious to it. Others, the ones not afflicted, get to watch the deterioration and can do very little to stop it. AJ's question is so puerile, but he fails to see that it is simply the "rock too big to lift" bunkum that atheists love to spout, but dressed up in a Wookie costume. If you look you can see the zipper running up the back. God is righteously arbitrary, but He cannot oppose the reality that is defined by His own character. He cannot arbitrarily create a rock too big to lift. He cannot make a contradiction true. He cannot be evil. He cannot lie. He cannot renege on His promises, no matter how much Open Deists want to believe He can. And He cannot arbitrarily choose to love Satan.
Originally Posted by Hilston:
No "omnicompetent" God would sit idly by and watch thousands of people He loves and wants to save plunge into hell and not lift a finger to stop it.
apologetic jedi said:
That assumes:
1) That God's desire to "win" souls stems from a mere competitive measure, rather than a desire for a synergistic relationship, which would take precedence.
I see, so God doesn't mind the fact that the number of lost relationships outpaces the number of saved ones every day this world continues to exist?
apologetic jedi said:
2) That God isn't working today, and hasn't worked in the past to try to persuade people.
What
is God doing today to try to persuade people?
apologetic jedi said:
3) That a forced worship is the kind of worship God would cherish over an un-coerced worship.
No one is forced to worship God. God changes the rebellious God-hating heart to a God-loving heart. The worship comes uncoerced from a heart that loves God.