Am I saved from the Christian point of view?

[Clete]

I agree that the KJV is the best English translation available. If you feel some need to brand me with a name for then then knock yourself out.

It isn't about me, it's about being honest and not being afraid of a label that fits. You don't agree with the Crusades or the Spanish Inquisition but aren't afraid to wear the label "Christian". Likewise, you aren't a Lutheran but aren't afraid for someone to think you're a Protestant. You aren't the biggest fan of the IRS but don't mind someone calling you an American.

Labels work, Marke. They're an important part of ANY language and refusing a label for the sake of refusing labels is simple stupidity. It's something liberals do and it doesn't change a thing other than the ability of others to communicate well with you and you with them.

 

[Clete]

I believe some manuscripts are more accurate representations or preservations of God's word and that the KJV is the most accurate English translation I know about.

Was that a yes or a no, Marke?

However, God's word is not in letters but in spirit and Christians must seek God in order to understand His word in ways that cannot be achieved by just studying the preserved writings through which we are introduced to and made familiar with God's word.

Danger!

Run from any lunatic that tells you that you need something other than the bible to understand God's word.

"God was such a terrible writer, wasn't He! I mean, I until I got 'spiritual' and started seeking God outside His written word, I couldn't make heads nor tails of the bible. Now I commune with the Father on a higher level than I every thought possible and you can do it too! Just come to my commune and drink this cool-aid!" - Every fool who thought he was wiser than God and could out wit the bible.

I know that you weren't intending to imply any such outlandish thing but my point is that that's where the premise "Christians must seek God in order to understand His word in ways that cannot be achieved by just studying the preserved writings" leads.

Besides that, how is that in anyway compatible with your thinking on the subject of the KJV? What would be the point of thinking that the KJV is God's preserved word on Earth if its true that, "Christians must seek God in order to understand His word in ways that cannot be achieved by just studying the preserved writings"? If that's the case then who needs the preserved writings in the first place?

 

[marke]

It isn't about me, it's about being honest and not being afraid of a label that fits. You don't agree with the Crusades or the Spanish Inquisition but aren't afraid to wear the label "Christian". Likewise, you aren't a Lutheran but aren't afraid for someone to think you're a Protestant. You aren't the biggest fan of the IRS but don't mind someone calling you an American.

Labels work, Marke. They're an important part of ANY language and refusing a label for the sake of refusing labels is simple stupidity. It's something liberals do and it doesn't change a thing other than the ability of others to communicate well with you and you with them.

I am not opposed to people calling me names or putting labels on me if that is something that makes their juices flow.

 

[marke]

Was that a yes or a no, Marke?

What was the question again?

Danger!

Run from any lunatic that tells you that you need something other than the bible to understand God's word.

Wisdom comes from God. Christians not only need the Bible, but they need God to interpret it for them.

 

[Clete]

I am not opposed to people calling me names or putting labels on me if that is something that makes their juices flow.

Yeah, sure. That's why its like pulling teeth to get you to admit even something so mundane as believing that the King James is the only bible worth reading.

The reason you won't own up to it is because you know intuitively that it is an indefensible position to hold but can't bring yourself to let go of it. Your aversion to labels is just an emotional crutch and intellectual escape hatch.

My advice is have the courage of your convictions or keep your mouth shut.

 

[Clete]

What was the question again?

You are just so lazy! The thread is all right for the entire world to read, Marke, and the question was asked less than two iterations of this conversation ago.

You had said that you don't believe that the KJV is more inspired than manuscript copies of the original writings.
That, I believe left too much wiggle room so I asked....

Do you believe that the KJV is JUST AS inspired as manuscript copies of the original writings?

Wisdom comes from God. Christians not only need the Bible, but they need God to interpret it for them.

You'd better check that, Marke! That's just exactly the sort of thing that any cult leader you care to name would have said. The bible teaches otherwise. Where exactly do you think the bible comes from anyway, the Tooth Fairy?

Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?​

​

17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.​

​

Clete

 

[marke]

You are just so lazy! The thread is all right for the entire world to read, Marke, and the question was asked less than two iterations of this conversation ago.

You had said that you don't believe that the KJV is more inspired than manuscript copies of the original writings.
That question, I believe left too much wiggle room so I asked....

Do you believe that the KJV is JUST AS inspired as manuscript copies of the original writings?

Yes. I believe the adjective "inspired" applies equally to all accurate transcriptions and translations of God's word.

You're better check that, Marke! That's just exactly the sort of thing that any cult leader you care to name would have said. The bible teaches otherwise. Where exactly do you think the bible comes from anyway, the Tooth Fairy?

Romans 10:14 How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher?​

​

17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.​

​

Clete

Wisdom comes from God. Faith comes from studying and learning God's word.

 

[Rhema]

You make questionable claims that have no verifiable significance.

Marke, you're not qualified enough to make that decision.

Your posts on this issue have always been one of irrational emotion, not scholarly reason.

A reformed Greek text has no value outside of the camp started by Westcott and Hort.

Someone "poisoned the well" and your views are based on your hatred for Westcott and Hort. The world has moved on from them, why can't you?

sending Tischendorf, like sending Baalim

Again, your "belief" is emotional rhetoric, not one of studied reason.

But maybe you are that insecure emotionally and unable to accept well reasoned facts.

You're going to reject Wallace? Mounce? Metzger?
(But why do I even ask, of course you will.. you have an emotional need to.)

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

Danger!

Run from any lunatic that tells you that you need something other than the bible to understand God's word.

(Acts 8:30-31 KJV) And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest? And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.​

Poor Phillip.

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

17 So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.Clete

Clete, with all due respect, that doesn't mean Bible.

ακοη δια ρηματος θεου

Find out what ρηματος θεου means.

Thanks,
Rhema
(I'm sure you don't need a hint.)

 

[Rhema]

Yes. I believe the adjective "inspired" applies equally to all accurate transcriptions and translations of God's word.

The TR is not accurate.

Whoever told you it was, wasn't being honest.

Rhema

 

[marke]

Marke, you're not qualified enough to make that decision.
Your posts on this issue have always been one of irrational emotion, not scholarly reason.
Someone "poisoned the well" and your views are based on your hatred for Westcott and Hort. The world has moved on from them, why can't you?

Westcott poisoned his own well by espousing doctrinal errors and elevating the seriously flawed, clearly counterfeit Sinaiticus manuscript above all others.

 

[marke]

The TR is not accurate.

Whoever told you it was, wasn't being honest.

Rhema

Men like John Burgon favored the TR. Men like Westcott favored flawed manuscripts. Burgon was far more persuasive in his arguments than were Westcott and his crowd of textual critics.

 

[Clete]

Yes. I believe the adjective "inspired" applies equally to all accurate transcriptions and translations of God's word.

Why didn't you just say so from the start?

On what basis then should anyone, anywhere ever use anything other than the KJV?

Wisdom comes from God. Faith comes from studying and learning God's word.

As though faith and wisdom are two unrelated things that do not spring from the same Fountainhead. Read the book of Proverbs much?

Have ever backed, even a single inch, off of a single overstated doctrine that you ever let fall out of your mindless mouth?

 

[Clete]

(Acts 8:30-31 KJV) And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest? And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.​

Poor Phillip.

Rhema

Was Philip alive before or after the bible was complete? Yes, I'm quite certain it was before!
Was Philip a Jew saved under the Dispensation of Circumcision? Yes! Definitely before the age of Grace.

Your understanding the bible is so paper thin it's laughable and tragic at the same time. Laughable because you're literally a bafoon. Tragic because, as is true of all fools who think themselves wise, you have no escape.

 

[marke]

Why didn't you just say so from the start?

On what basis then should anyone, anywhere ever use anything other than the KJV?


As though faith and wisdom are two unrelated things that do not spring from the same Fountainhead. Read the book of Proverbs much?

Have ever backed, even a single inch, off of a single overstated doctrine that you ever let fall out of your mindless mouth?

Watch your tongue. The Lord does not appreciate false accusations and unjust slanders hurled at His children.

 

[Clete]

Watch your tongue. The Lord does not appreciate false accusations and unjust slanders hurled at His children.

Ha! I'll take that as a, "No!"

Hypocrite!

It is not advisable to venture unsolicited opinions. You should spare yourself the embarrassing discovery of their exact value to your listener.

 

[Rhema]

Westcott poisoned his own well by espousing doctrinal errors and elevating the seriously flawed, clearly counterfeit Sinaiticus manuscript above all others.

Well I was going to apologize for saying that "you're not qualified enough to make that decision," and ask what you think makes you qualified, but I see from this post that you've rather proven my case. It would be waste of my breath to say that you are quite in error about the Sinaiticus manuscript and suggest that you actually do some research on your own. I'm just beginning to understand that there are some people who revel, if not glory, in their own ignorance.

Men like John Burgon

Indeed, you have been sorely misled by others who are also not qualified enough to make those decisions.

Westcott poisoned his own well by espousing doctrinal errors

Which ones?

And yes, I'm asking YOU which "doctrinal errors" you have discovered and feel qualified to charge Westcott with, not repeating the slander and misrepresentations from other authors you may have read.

If you're qualified, you will have read Westcott's works (and I don't think you have) in order to cast such aspersions of character.

And if you're honest, you'll just admit you have only second hand information about this topic.

Men like Westcott favored flawed manuscripts

You cannot call them flawed if you cannot enumerate these flaws. (So list one...)

You are just hurling insults at things you don't know about, because you're also denigrating the work of Nestle, Aland, Wallace, Marshall, and Metzger. YOU can't even read Greek, and yet you feel qualified enough to reject the work of nearly the entire field of Greek studies.

(What ballsies, man.)

Rhema

 

[Rhema]

Definitely before the age of Grace.

So I see you are a disciple of Bullinger.

Ah well... I am not.

Laughable because you're literally a bafoon.

Buffoon misspells Buffoon.

Oh the irony.
What joy.








... and screen shot....

 

[Rhema]

Watch your tongue. The Lord does not appreciate false accusations and unjust slanders hurled at His children.

Like Westcott? Metzger? Wallace? Marshall? Nestle? Aland?

Darn... you guys just went and broke my irony meter.