A message to all Pastors--

[Jerry Shugart]

If I understand you correctly.

The ones taken are the mortals who Christ chooses to gather to Jerusalem where the eagles (the resurrected saints are gathered with Christ.

Please answer the question in regard to those who will be taken in this passage:

"But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left" (Mt.24:37-41).​

Are the ones who will "be taken" are the same ones who will meet the Lord Jesus in the air? After all, these verses are describing His coming which will happen after the great tribulation is over (Mt.24:29).

A simple "yes" or "no" will suffice and should be no problem for someone like you who seems to think you are an expert on this subject.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

If I understand you correctly.

The ones taken are the mortals who Christ chooses to gather to Jerusalem where the eagles (the resurrected saints are gathered with Christ.

However the resurrection of the saints occurs at Christs appearing to all the world and continues with the gathering of the mortals while the vials of wrath upon the beasts kingdom is in progress.

Rev 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

Rev 6:14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

Rev 10:1 And I saw another mighty angel come down from heaven, clothed with a cloud: and a rainbow was upon his head, and his face was as it were the sun, and his feet as pillars of fire:
Rev 10:2 And he had in his hand a little book open: and he set his right foot upon the sea, and his left foot on the earth,
Rev 10:3 And cried with a loud voice, as when a lion roareth: and when he had cried, seven thunders uttered their voices.
Rev 10:4 And when the seven thunders had uttered their voices, I was about to write: and I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Seal up those things which the seven thunders uttered, and write them not.
Rev 10:5 And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven,
Rev 10:6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:
Rev 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Rev 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.
Rev 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
Rev 18:3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.


LA

Please answer the question in regard to those who will be taken in this passage:

"But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left" (Mt.24:37-41).​

Are the ones who will "be taken" are the same ones who will meet the Lord Jesus in the air? After all, these verses are describing His coming which will happen after the great tribulation is over (Mt.24:29).

A simple "yes" or "no" will suffice and should be no problem for someone like you who seems to think you are an expert on this subject.

Answered above.

LA

 

[Lazy afternoon]

"Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth" (Rev.3:10).​

You are wrong, as usual. The combination of the verb "keep" with the preposition "from" means that they will kept "out" of the time period referred to as the "temptation" which will come upon all the world.

It does not say they are kept out of the time period, only that they are kept.

One can be kept out of the trial without having to go in a rapture.

Nothing is said about the resurrection here at all, not even the time of the rapture.

You are reading into the text again your own thoughts.


Luk 21:23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
Luk 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.
Luk 21:25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
Luk 21:26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
Luk 21:27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Luk 21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
Luk 21:34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.
Luk 21:35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.
Luk 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

The passages are saying one must be faithful in the midst of temptation to be found worthy to escape all these things at the coming of the Lord.

As also said here--

1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
1Th 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
1Th 4:18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

1Th 5:1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
1Th 5:4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
1Th 5:6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.
1Th 5:7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.
1Th 5:8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.
1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

LA

 

[musterion]

Just for the record,

I have had nothing to do with those people.

Why you should try to harass me when I am posting scripture is beyond me.

You're a charismatic.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

You're a charismatic.

just a plain ordinary Acts 2 Christian who believers Christ--and Paul--

Act 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Act 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Act 2:40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Act 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
Act 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers.
Act 2:43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles.
Act 2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common;
Act 2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need.
Act 2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,
Act 2:47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Mar 16:17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
Mar 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

1Co 12:4 Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1Co 12:5 And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord.
1Co 12:6 And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all.
1Co 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
1Co 12:8 For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit;
1Co 12:9 To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit;
1Co 12:10 To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues:
1Co 12:11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
1Co 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.
1Co 12:13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

LA

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Not a hill to die on. We'll know by 15 Mar 17. :juggle:

As a reminder Lazy afternoon is number 11 on Satan, Inc. (TOL Heretics list) in "The 'Jesus is not God' people (Non-trinitarians) category. :burnlib:

WARNING!! Stay off of that LA Freeway, it's congested with false doctrine and confusion. You have been warned, TOL posters.

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Just for the record,

I have had nothing to do with those people.

Why you should try to harass me when I am posting scripture is beyond me.

LA

What's your latest "DEATH PREDICTION?" LA has a habit of predicting Posters deaths. Of course, they NEVER come to fruition. She's been saying for years now, that I will be beheaded. She's also predicted other's deaths.

:execute:

 

[Grosnick Marowbe]

Just for the record,

I have had nothing to do with those people.

Why you should try to harass me when I am posting scripture is beyond me.

LA

The TRUTH is beyond you.

 

[Jerry Shugart]

The ones taken are the mortals who Christ chooses to gather to Jerusalem where the eagles (the resurrected saints are gathered with Christ.

You are wrong and you now have a huge problem. The ones who will be "taken" will be the unrighteous. The answer which the Lord gave in regard to the ones who will be "taken" was in answer to the following question from His disciples:

"Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the age?" (Mt. 24:3).​

Earlier the Lord Jesus spoke the parable of the "tares of the field" where He described what would occur at the "end of the age":

"He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the age; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this age. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear" (Mt. 13:37-43).​

Here we can see that the Lord Jesus speaks of a harvest that will happen at the "end of the age." And at the end of the age the ones who will be "taken" will be those who offend and not the saints, as you imagine!

That leaves you with a huge problem in regard to this post-tribulation coming of the Lord Jesus:

"But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left" (Mt.24:37-41).​

If the ones taken are the saints, as you imagine, then by the time all the saints are caught up to meet the Lord in the air and all those who offend are taken out of the world then no one will be left on the face of the earth when He comes.

How do you solve that problem?

 

[john w]

Your harshing his anointing, JohnW. Jan Crouch warned there's a special level of Hadesgehennahell for mocking mockers such as you. Bewayre the Lowerd's uhnointed, JohnW! BEWAYRE!!!

You need to puh ray for the second rain, and guh-lohreeeee clawd, and toucheth not the Laaaaawd's anointed, mustee!!!!!!!!!!!

Do I hear an Ay-men, saints?!!!!

 

[CherubRam]

Not a hill to die on. We'll know by 15 Mar 17. :juggle:

As a reminder Lazy afternoon is number 11 on Satan, Inc. (TOL Heretics list) in "The 'Jesus is not God' people (Non-trinitarians) category. :burnlib:

All of the people in heaven are called (elohiym /gods.) Yahshua even said he was a god. See: Psalm 82:6
I said, "You are gods; you are all sons of the Most High.

John 10:33-34
33"We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be [a god] God."
34 Yahshua answered them, "Is it not written in your Law, 'I have said you are gods'? 35If he called them 'gods,' to whom the word of God came—and the Scripture cannot be broken— 36what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, 'I am God's Son'?

Yahshua was asked if he was the Messiah, he was not asked if he was God. It has always been understood that the Messiah would be a god from Heaven.

John 10:24. The Jews who were there gathered around him, asking, “How long will you keep us in suspense, if you’re the Messiah, tell us plainly?”

 

[Lazy afternoon]

What's your latest "DEATH PREDICTION?" LA has a habit of predicting Posters deaths. Of course, they NEVER come to fruition. She's been saying for years now, that I will be beheaded. She's also predicted other's deaths.

:execute:

The lord will answer you in due course.

You will have to decide between having your head cut off and taking the mark.

The evidence of your posts so far is that you will betray the Christians and take the mark.

All like Judas will do that.

LA

 

[Bright Raven]

The lord will answer you in due course.

You will have to decide between having your head cut off and taking the mark.

The evidence of your posts so far is that you will betray the Christians and take the mark.

All like Judas will do that.

LA

That is only if we live into the tribulation.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

You are wrong and you now have a huge problem. The ones who will be "taken" will be the unrighteous. The answer which the Lord gave in regard to the ones who will be "taken" was in answer to the following question from His disciples:

"Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the age?" (Mt. 24:3).​

Earlier the Lord Jesus spoke the parable of the "tares of the field" where He described what would occur at the "end of the age":

"He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the age; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this age. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear" (Mt. 13:37-43).​

Here we can see that the Lord Jesus speaks of a harvest that will happen at the "end of the age." And at the end of the age the ones who will be "taken" will be those who offend and not the saints, as you imagine!

That leaves you with a huge problem in regard to this post-tribulation coming of the Lord Jesus:

"But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left" (Mt.24:37-41).​

If the ones taken are the saints, as you imagine, then by the time all the saints are caught up to meet the Lord in the air and all those who offend are taken out of the world then no one will be left on the face of the earth when He comes.

How do you solve that problem?

No problem.

You used Mat.13 verses which describe the last judgment, not the return of Christ.

For one thing at the return of Christ the bodies of the wicked are laying on the ground, and taken nowhere.

Then you claim a wicked beast worshipper is grinding at the mill with a righteous person.

Perhaps you think they will be in bed together.

At Christs coming only the righteous are gathered by angels (if necessary) and the wicked remain as the example of Lot and Noah shows.

This does not mean that those not gathered are all wicked either, it depends on where they are, and who they are.

Deu 30:1 And it shall come to pass, when all these things are come upon thee, the blessing and the curse, which I have set before thee, and thou shalt call them to mind among all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath driven thee,
Deu 30:2 And shalt return unto the LORD thy God, and shalt obey his voice according to all that I command thee this day, thou and thy children, with all thine heart, and with all thy soul;
Deu 30:3 That then the LORD thy God will turn thy captivity, and have compassion upon thee, and will return and gather thee from all the nations, whither the LORD thy God hath scattered thee.
Deu 30:4 If any of thine be driven out unto the outmost parts of heaven, from thence will the LORD thy God gather thee, and from thence will he fetch thee:
Deu 30:5 And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.


Rev 18:1 And after these things I saw another angel come down from heaven, having great power; and the earth was lightened with his glory.
Rev 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.
Rev 18:3 For all nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies.
Rev 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

First the resurrection at His appearing then follows the gathering by angels out of Babylon, many on foot.

Jer 50:1 The word that the LORD spake against Babylon and against the land of the Chaldeans by Jeremiah the prophet.
Jer 50:2 Declare ye among the nations, and publish, and set up a standard; publish, and conceal not: say, Babylon is taken, Bel is confounded, Merodach is broken in pieces; her idols are confounded, her images are broken in pieces.
Jer 50:3 For out of the north there cometh up a nation against her, which shall make her land desolate, and none shall dwell therein: they shall remove, they shall depart, both man and beast.
Jer 50:4 In those days, and in that time, saith the LORD, the children of Israel shall come, they and the children of Judah together, going and weeping: they shall go, and seek the LORD their God.
Jer 50:5 They shall ask the way to Zion with their faces thitherward, saying, Come, and let us join ourselves to the LORD in a perpetual covenant that shall not be forgotten.
Jer 50:6 My people hath been lost sheep: their shepherds have caused them to go astray, they have turned them away on the mountains: they have gone from mountain to hill, they have forgotten their restingplace.
Jer 50:7 All that found them have devoured them: and their adversaries said, We offend not, because they have sinned against the LORD, the habitation of justice, even the LORD, the hope of their fathers.
Jer 50:8 Remove out of the midst of Babylon, and go forth out of the land of the Chaldeans, and be as the he goats before the flocks.
Jer 50:9 For, lo, I will raise and cause to come up against Babylon an assembly of great nations from the north country: and they shall set themselves in array against her; from thence she shall be taken: their arrows shall be as of a mighty expert man; none shall return in vain.
Jer 50:10 And Chaldea shall be a spoil: all that spoil her shall be satisfied, saith the LORD.

Added comment-

Those gathered to amageddon, get there on their own means of transport.

LA

 

[Lazy afternoon]

That is only if we live into the tribulation.

Tell that to the thousands of Christians in the middle east who were beheaded, while Obama on your behalf did nothing but arm the rebels.

LA

 

[Bright Raven]

Tell that to the thousands of Christians in the middle east who were beheaded, while Obama on your behalf did nothing but arm the rebels.

LA

I did not vote for Obama and as far as I am concerned he was not my president. I looked upon the day he left office with joy.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

I did not vote for Obama and as far as I am concerned he was not my president. I looked upon the day he left office with joy.

Yes, did you see where he let it slip that he is a muslim, then corrected himself and said Christian.

However it seems that the Christians will try now but they all fail.

The reliance on guns and money at home and abroad is the undoing of most all.

Psa 20:7 Some trust in chariots, and some in horses: but we will remember the name of the LORD our God.
Psa 20:8 They are brought down and fallen: but we are risen, and stand upright.

Isa 2:7 Their land also is full of silver and gold, neither is there any end of their treasures; their land is also full of horses, neither is there any end of their chariots:
Isa 2:8 Their land also is full of idols; they worship the work of their own hands, that which their own fingers have made:

LA

 

[Bright Raven]

Yes, did you see where he let it slip that he is a muslim, then corrected himself and said Christian.

However it seems that the Christians will try now but they all fail.

The reliance on guns and money at home and abroad is the undoing of most all.

Psa 20:7 Some trust in chariots, and some in horses: but we will remember the name of the LORD our God.
Psa 20:8 They are brought down and fallen: but we are risen, and stand upright.

Isa 2:7 Their land also is full of silver and gold, neither is there any end of their treasures; their land is also full of horses, neither is there any end of their chariots:
Isa 2:8 Their land also is full of idols; they worship the work of their own hands, that which their own fingers have made:

LA

So what is your point?

 

[God's Truth]

but the Lord can not deliver them who call His children devils and the Lord of them a demon.

LA

Then according to your teachings you will not be delivered.

 

[Lazy afternoon]

Then according to your teachings you will not be delivered.

So be it if the lord so decides, but you know very well that I was referring to people who called me a devil don't you.

You will grasp at almost anything to defend your claim that Jesus is only the Father in a human body.

You confess no mediator between you and God.

1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

LA