ECT WHEN ARE GIFTS GIVEN ?

DAN P

Well-known member
Hi to all the discussion of gifts will always be difficult !!

Rom 12:6 reads And Having gifts of Grace , varying in kind according to the Grace having beem given to US , whether Prophecy , according to the PROPORTION of FAITH !

In the the Gospels gifts were given by Christ and much authority as in John 20:22-23 to REMIT SINS !!

And you all wonder why TONGUES gave CEASED during the dispensation of Grace , ks because Israel has been set aside as in Luke 13:6-9 !!

Yet there are gifts for the BODY , according to the PROPORTION OF the believers FAITH !!Rom 12:6 begings withe a PARTICIPLE " HAVING / ECHO " which is in the PRESENT TENSE in the Dispensation of the Grace of God and is not speaking to those who hold and Acts 2 position !!

It looks like your FAITH will depend on what GIFT you can receive !!

dan p
 
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TweetyBird

New member
Hi to all the discussion of gifts will always be difficult !!

Rom 12:6 reads And Having gifts of Grace , varying in kind according to the Grace having beem given to US , whether Prophecy , according to the PROPORTION of FAITH !

In the the Gospels gifts were given by Christ and much authority as in John 20:22-23 to REMIT SINS !!

And ylou all wonder why TONGUES gave CEASED during the dispensation of Grace , ks because Israel has been set aside as in Luke 13:6-9 !!

Yet there are gifts for the BODY , according to the PROPORTION OF the believers FAITH !!Rom 12:6 begings withe a PARTICIPLE " HAVING / ECHO " which is in the PRESENT TENSE in the Dispensation of the Grace of God and is not speaking to those who hold and Acts 2 position !!

It looks like your FAITH will depend on what GIFT you can receive !!

dan p


What do you think Paul meant in verse 3? Do you see a connection to what is given by God to where that proportion comes from?

Rom 12
3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith. 4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office: 5 so we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another. 6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;
 

DAN P

Well-known member
What do you think Paul meant in verse 3? Do you see a connection to what is given by God to where that proportion comes from?

Rom 12
3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith. 4 For as we have many members in one body, and all members have not the same office: 5 so we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another. 6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;


Hi and here is the best translation I have found on Rom 12:3 !!

For I day through the Grace HAVING been given to me , to weveryone that is being among , not to think more highly of ONE'S self above that it is necessary to think , but to in order to THINK SOBERLY , as God has divided out to EACH a measure of FAITH !!

31 , First NOT all believers will advance to Adulthood !!

#2 , To think SOBERLY means to , AS HAVING A SOUND MIND !!

#3 , Faith is divided out by God Himself at the TIME of your salvation as the verb " hadth dealt " is a verb in the Aorist tense or Past tense in English !!

#4 , The verb " to think more highly " is in the Present tense and that means only in the Dispensation of the Grace of God !!

#5, So some will think , that they were not placed in a HIGHLY position in the Body !!

This is my short answer as there are 7 action verbs in verse 3 !!

dan p
 

TweetyBird

New member
Hi and here is the best translation I have found on Rom 12:3 !!

For I day through the Grace HAVING been given to me , to weveryone that is being among , not to think more highly of ONE'S self above that it is necessary to think , but to in order to THINK SOBERLY , as God has divided out to EACH a measure of FAITH !!

31 , First NOT all believers will advance to Adulthood !!

#2 , To think SOBERLY means to , AS HAVING A SOUND MIND !!

#3 , Faith is divided out by God Himself at the TIME of your salvation as the verb " hadth dealt " is a verb in the Aorist tense or Past tense in English !!

#4 , The verb " to think more highly " is in the Present tense and that means only in the Dispensation of the Grace of God !!

#5, So some will think , that they were not placed in a HIGHLY position in the Body !!

This is my short answer as there are 7 action verbs in verse 3 !!

dan p

That is not what I was referring to, however. Do you not see the connection in verse 3 that God gives the measure of faith and that is referred to as proportionate in verse 6?
 

DAN P

Well-known member
That is not what I was referring to, however. Do you not see the connection in verse 3 that God gives the measure of faith and that is referred to as proportionate in verse 6?


Hi and I am think that it proportionate as how God divides and gives faith , which is kin God's power !!

dan p
 

TweetyBird

New member
Hi and who else has the power to give GIFTS to the Body of Christ ??

dan p

I think you are confusing the issue. Perhaps purposefully? You made the connection to the proportion of faith to power. So far, you have not proved your theory.
 

DAN P

Well-known member
I think you are confusing the issue. Perhaps purposefully? You made the connection to the proportion of faith to power. So far, you have not proved your theory.


Hi and you say PURPOSELLY you say , then you have the Gift of Knowledge ?

I say that you just do NOT understand what the Holy Spirit has written through Paul !!

So , you are not Pauline , I think , so what do you believe concerning Paul ??

dan p
 

DAN P

Well-known member
I think you are confusing the issue. Perhaps purposefully? You made the connection to the proportion of faith to power. So far, you have not proved your theory.


Hi and you say that I am confusing the issue , what do you thing about Rom 12:3-8

dan p
 

Danoh

New member
What is "how God divides and gives faith , which is kin God's power"? What power are you referring to?

Perhaps he meant the following...

Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Romans 12:6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;

Ephesians 4:7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ. 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.

Ephesians 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

That "effectual working" is the idea of a power or an empowerment working in each one that was meant to work in each of them as one.

The result being the Body members ending up working in harmony with one another as one; the result of that being one strong unit.

Much like how a squad is meant to work in the military: it is their harmony as one that results in their being a rather capable force.

At Corinth that had not been possible because they were too busy trying to out do one another.

The result being that instead of projecting Christ; they were projecting their own nonsense as coming from one another.

The result of that being that they ended up reading their nonsense as being what Paul himself had been up to!

But the fact was that they were unwisely measuring themselves among themselves.

The result being that the power in them had been nullified.

You'll note that in the latter half of Ephesians 4, Paul goes into what their perspective should be, when looking at things.

Some years ago, a sister in the Lord was complaining to me about a coworker who was always very mean to her.

She was at her wits end as to what to do.

Her victory in the Lord had been nullified by how she had allowed herself to perceive her coworker's actions.

I told her that it is easy to "love Jesus."

That what can be difficult if viewed from an improper perspective, is how to tap into the grace wherein we stand in Him when faced with life's issues.

We went over various passages towards basically helping her be able to take such things as water off a duck's back.

Some weeks passed.

She walks up to me one day to tell me things were fine now.

That her coworker had not only left her alone, but had even defended her in one instance.

Her coworker had told her she had defended her because she had begun to feel bad when her attacks had begun to be met with that sisters "cup of cold water" in return.

Romans 12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

Doesn't always work in the other person though :chuckle:

I once had a supervisor who was really difficult because I would not give in to her wanting to date me (even though she had already had a boyfriend!)

One day she ended up with a really bad cold but had to work anyway.

The next day I brought her a bowl of chicken soup I had made from scratch.

As much towards her well being as for my own spiritual stability, given how difficult she was.

She knew I had made it myself because I often invited coworkers over and cooked for them; work buddies, and such.

Her response was classic her, lol

"Tell who ever made that soup it was so so..."

Even though she ate all of it - emptied the entire thermos :chuckle:

Me; I was fine.

I had tapped into the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

It is how the power works now; this side of "that which is perfect."

Anyway, hope that gives you some insight into this power able to work in the measure of every part those passages are talking about.

How to tap into same...

Ephesians 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind, 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart: 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness. 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ; 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus: 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

There is power in the Blood!

Wonder working Power!
 

TweetyBird

New member
Hi and you say PURPOSELLY you say , then you have the Gift of Knowledge ?

I say that you just do NOT understand what the Holy Spirit has written through Paul !!

So , you are not Pauline , I think , so what do you believe concerning Paul ??

dan p

I love Paul - but he is not supporting what you have said, for sure :eek:
 

TweetyBird

New member
Perhaps he meant the following...

Romans 12:3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

Romans 12:6 Having then gifts differing according to the grace that is given to us, whether prophecy, let us prophesy according to the proportion of faith;

Ephesians 4:7 But unto every one of us is given grace according to the measure of the gift of Christ. 4:8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.

Ephesians 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

That "effectual working" is the idea of a power or an empowerment working in each one that was meant to work in each of them as one.

The result being the Body members ending up working in harmony with one another as one; the result of that being one strong unit.

Much like how a squad is meant to work in the military: it is their harmony as one that results in their being a rather capable force.

At Corinth that had not been possible because they were too busy trying to out do one another.

The result being that instead of projecting Christ; they were projecting their own nonsense as coming from one another.

The result of that being that they ended up reading their nonsense as being what Paul himself had been up to!

But the fact was that they were unwisely measuring themselves among themselves.

The result being that the power in them had been nullified.

You'll note that in the latter half of Ephesians 4, Paul goes into what their perspective should be, when looking at things.

Some years ago, a sister in the Lord was complaining to me about a coworker who was always very mean to her.

She was at her wits end as to what to do.

Her victory in the Lord had been nullified by how she had allowed herself to perceive her coworker's actions.

I told her that it is easy to "love Jesus."

That what can be difficult if viewed from an improper perspective, is how to tap into the grace wherein we stand in Him when faced with life's issues.

We went over various passages towards basically helping her be able to take such things as water off a duck's back.

Some weeks passed.

She walks up to me one day to tell me things were fine now.

That her coworker had not only left her alone, but had even defended her in one instance.

Her coworker had told her she had defended her because she had begun to feel bad when her attacks had begun to be met with that sisters "cup of cold water" in return.

Romans 12:20 Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

Doesn't always work in the other person though :chuckle:

I once had a supervisor who was really difficult because I would not give in to her wanting to date me (even though she had already had a boyfriend!)

One day she ended up with a really bad cold but had to work anyway.

The next day I brought her a bowl of chicken soup I had made from scratch.

As much towards her well being as for my own spiritual stability, given how difficult she was.

She knew I had made it myself because I often invited coworkers over and cooked for them; work buddies, and such.

Her response was classic her, lol

"Tell who ever made that soup it was so so..."

Even though she ate all of it - emptied the entire thermos :chuckle:

Me; I was fine.

I had tapped into the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

It is how the power works now; this side of "that which is perfect."

Anyway, hope that gives you some insight into this power able to work in the measure of every part those passages are talking about.

How to tap into same...

Ephesians 4:17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind, 4:18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart: 4:19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness. 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ; 4:21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus: 4:22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; 4:23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

There is power in the Blood!

Wonder working Power!

The "power of the blood" is forgiveness of sins.
 

DAN P

Well-known member
I love Paul - but he is not supporting what you have said, for sure :eek:

Hi and then 1 Cor 13:8 , where The Holy Spirit say that ;

#1 , Wjether Prophecies they shall be ABOLISHED , it not there ?

#2 , Whether LANGUAGES , is not there either ?

#3 , Whether Knowlefge , it will be ABOLISHED , is also not there !!

Then you are teaching heresy !!

dan p
 

Danoh

New member
The "power of the blood" is forgiveness of sins.

I appreciate the intended correction :)

Nothing to worry about, though; I was merely reflecting on the starting point of God's grace power.

Note it here; for example...

Ephesians 4:32 And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

Grace Motivation!

:)
 

TweetyBird

New member
Hi and then 1 Cor 13:8 , where The Holy Spirit say that ;

#1 , Wjether Prophecies they shall be ABOLISHED , it not there ?

#2 , Whether LANGUAGES , is not there either ?

#3 , Whether Knowlefge , it will be ABOLISHED , is also not there !!

Then you are teaching heresy !!

dan p

What does any of that have to do with the measure of faith given by God? You keep switching lanes without using you signal :)
 
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