ECT What's New (Covenant)?

I

Interplanner

Well-known member
If the D'ist new covenant is people under the law in Judea in some sort of attempt to 'do it right' finally, then what is 'new' (Christocentric) about the thing? Is this D'ism's way of being obsessed with changed humans and not realizing that the Biblical message is actually about what was accomplished in Christ historically for sinners?
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
If the D'ist new covenant is people under the law in Judea in some sort of attempt to 'do it right' finally, then what is 'new' (Christocentric) about the thing? Is this D'ism's way of being obsessed with changed humans and not realizing that the Biblical message is actually about what was accomplished in Christ historically for sinners?
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At this time in history, Churchianity and IP have a narrow minded view of ALL the things that Christ was doing and will do. They narrowly focus on the completely self-centered idea that Christ was ALL about dealing with their sins and nothing else.

Ezekiel prophecies about the time when God will restore Israel and establish His new covenant with them:

Ezek 36:24-28 (AKJV/PCE)​
(36:24) For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. (36:25) ¶ Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. (36:26) A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. (36:27) And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them]. (36:28) And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
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Praise God for ALL that He does and will do.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
Right Divider said:
At this time in history, Churchianity and IP have a narrow minded view of ALL the things that Christ was doing and will do. They narrowly focus on the completely self-centered idea that Christ was ALL about dealing with their sins and nothing else.

Ezekiel prophecies about the time when God will restore Israel and establish His new covenant with them:

Ezek 36:24-28 (AKJV/PCE)​
(36:24) For I will take you from among the heathen, and gather you out of all countries, and will bring you into your own land. (36:25) ¶ Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. (36:26) A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. (36:27) And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them]. (36:28) And ye shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; and ye shall be my people, and I will be your God.
​

Praise God for ALL that He does and will do.
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That's what he has already done. There are plenty of quotes of Ezek and Zech in the NT to guide us. There is nothing self-centered about gaining justification. It would be self-centered if by works. God has no interest ongoing about temples on earth when his Son is the living temple.

Reminds me of meeting some Buddhists at a party this year and their ecstasy about a Buddhist temple near Ft. Collins CO. It's almost 100 feet tall, they exclaimed, as though either the height or a temple would mean anything.

The new thing about the covenant is how transcultural or portable it is. It has nothing to do with Judea, but everything to do with believers.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
The new covenant has been underway for 2000 years. Don't waste your life on D'ism that is so ignorant of what is going on.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

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Interplanner said:
That's what he has already done.
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Fiction from a master of fiction.

Interplanner said:
There are plenty of quotes of Ezek and Zech in the NT to guide us.
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And yet you are not kind enough to QUOTE them and show how they could possibly mean what you say that they mean.

Interplanner said:
There is nothing self-centered about gaining justification.
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Trying to TWIST my words like you try to TWIST the scripture. I did NOT say gaining justification was self-centered. I said:
Right Divider said:
At this time in history, Churchianity and IP have a narrow minded view of ALL the things that Christ was doing and will do. They narrowly focus on the completely self-centered idea that Christ was ALL about dealing with their sins and nothing else.
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So you are either INCOMPETENT in your reading comprehension or you are just an outright LIAR. Which is it?

Interplanner said:
It would be self-centered if by works. God has no interest ongoing about temples on earth when his Son is the living temple.
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God has no interest in your distortions of His Word.

Interplanner said:
Reminds me of meeting some Buddhists at a party this year and their ecstasy about a Buddhist temple near Ft. Collins CO. It's almost 100 feet tall, they exclaimed, as though either the height or a temple would mean anything.
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A wonderful NON-SEQUITUR. You are as illogical as you are fictitious.

Interplanner said:
The new thing about the covenant is how transcultural or portable it is. It has nothing to do with Judea, but everything to do with believers.
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Not the new covenant between God and Israel PER SCRIPTURE.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
already done:
He has created a new people, sometimes called the new man, that accomplishes his mission. That's what he was talking about in Mt 21's parable of the vineyard 'the nation.' It's an ethne when he could care less what your ethne is!

Ezek, Zech
I don't know of any NT quote of Ezek or Zech that is about anything beyond the destruction of Jerusalem. I mean what the NT quotes in an 'as it is written.' Mt 26 on Zech 13:7. So then much of that section of Zech must be related likewise. The strange thing about D'ism is it thinks the prophecies are some kind of a punchlist and our job is to go through and say yes or no. I never get that impression in the NT, because the final day was expected so soon. Moving it changes everything.

Do you know of a NT passage that refers to Zech or Ezek that is not about the suffering and preaching of Christ to the nations? An actual 'as it is written' quote?



I don't count quotes of the Rev because that is circular. The Rev says it is about things happening right then, quickly, immediately.

self-centered
SO Paul is therefore self-centered in Acts 26 when he says there is nothing to teach about beyond the suffering and preaching of Christ to the nations. Not about a separate future Israel like the Bible was a form of Nostradamus. Sorry, it's not on the list.

temples
check with Stephen in Acts 7:48.

It is the D'ism obsession with modern or future Israel that is fiction.


the new covenant
the most clear sign that a person is deluded by D'ism is the ability to block out all the passages about the new covenant in the NT that are not about Israel. Yet they do the most insisting that they are PER SCRIPTURE!!!

By the way, the trick of the letter to Hebrews is: who is 'us'? Who is the Israel in the Heb 8 quote of Jeremiah, because it makes the whole letter clear once we realize he's talking about the remnant, not the race, and the remnant shares everything with other believers, because there is one Gospel and truth and body.
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
SaulToPaul said:
:chuckle:

"God shall cause them to walk in his statutes, to observe and do them...."


This does not describe you.
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...unless the law is written on the persons heart, which is a spiritual question, which is a dirty word to you.

How are you coming on 'A Jew may be an atheist but is still a Jew, but Christian cannot be an atheist because it seriously opposes his behavioral base. I'd apply the behavioral rule to Judaism, but it doesn't apply.'?

That's a modern, old covenant Jewish person speaking, trying to do his best with the tools at hand.
 
Tambora

Tambora

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I see IP still has not accepted whom scripture says the new covenant was made to.
Jer 31:31
Heb 8:8
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
I don't accept what you say because the NT is perfectly clear that it is for all who believe. Do you notice you NEVER quote Matt 26, I Cor 10, 2 Cor 3?

You are frauds.

Our task is to convert them from Judaism, not to join them!

Nothing in hebrews is about the 'Israel' that you think. It is about the remnant, the believers, which means it is for all those who believe. It is new because Christ performed it, inspiring real love for God in us. It is not the Levitical system imposed on future Jews in Judea all over again. It is always about the Israel that believes, or the Israel of God, which is why heb 12:22+ is not about the old covenant, or the Judea of geography, or the race of Israel.

You are frauds, how you read most of this.

When Rom 11 talks about the covenant of the act of the Gospel, quoting Isaiah, its because it is not just new nor eternal. It is Christ the covenant for the nations. That is what was brought in Christ, the Redeemer who came to Zion, and is both new and eternal, because the old covenant was never supposed to be the permenant thing. It can't be for it is not Christ.

Our task is to convert them from Judaism, not to join them!
 
I

Interplanner

Well-known member
stp wrote:
Quote Originally Posted by SaulToPaul View Post
Yet, God is still not CAUSING you to walk in his statutes, and to do them.
Be honest.


Rom 8:7: 'the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so... You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit...'

this shows the theological and spiritual bankruptcy of D'ism. Oh, I see, Rom 8 is also "not written for me." Got it.
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
I don't accept what you say because the NT is perfectly clear that it is for all who believe. Do you notice you NEVER quote Matt 26, I Cor 10, 2 Cor 3?

You are frauds.

Our task is to convert them from Judaism, not to join them!

Nothing in hebrews is about the 'Israel' that you think. It is about the remnant, the believers, which means it is for all those who believe. It is new because Christ performed it, inspiring real love for God in us. It is not the Levitical system imposed on future Jews in Judea all over again. It is always about the Israel that believes, or the Israel of God, which is why heb 12:22+ is not about the old covenant, or the Judea of geography, or the race of Israel.

You are frauds, how you read most of this.

When Rom 11 talks about the covenant of the act of the Gospel, quoting Isaiah, its because it is not just new nor eternal. It is Christ the covenant for the nations. That is what was brought in Christ, the Redeemer who came to Zion, and is both new and eternal, because the old covenant was never supposed to be the permenant thing. It can't be for it is not Christ.

Our task is to convert them from Judaism, not to join them!
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Talk about frauds.... IP is the king of frauds.

In THIS dispensation WE are not trying to get anyone to "join with them". We are preaching the gospel of the grace of God.... something that God is doing NOW. God was NOT doing this before, nor will He be when He catches away His body and restores His earthly people.

Why do the TWELVE gates in the NEW Jerusalem have the names of the TWELVE TRIBES of the children of Israel?
 
Right Divider

Right Divider

Body part
Interplanner said:
stp wrote:
Quote Originally Posted by SaulToPaul View Post
Yet, God is still not CAUSING you to walk in his statutes, and to do them.
Be honest.

Rom 8:7: 'the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so... You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit...'

this shows the theological and spiritual bankruptcy of D'ism. Oh, I see, Rom 8 is also "not written for me." Got it.
Click to expand...
Seek immediate medical attention.
 
D

Danoh

New member
Interplanner said:
stp wrote:
Quote Originally Posted by SaulToPaul View Post
Yet, God is still not CAUSING you to walk in his statutes, and to do them.
Be honest.


Rom 8:7: 'the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God's law, nor can it do so... You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit...'

this shows the theological and spiritual bankruptcy of D'ism. Oh, I see, Rom 8 is also "not written for me." Got it.
Click to expand...

Nope.

Yours is "hollines movement" error.

In Rom. 6-8; 2 Cor. 3; Gal. 3; etc., Paul is talking about the ENABLEMENT the Believer has ACCESS TO.

It is not an AUTOMATIC compulsion.

Thus, why Paul invests so much time having to remind the various assemblies back then about these things - because as many individuals walked after the Spirit, as not...if not more so.

Because having been enabled to walk in the Spirit is just that - an ENABLEMENT.

It is not an automatic COMPULSION.

It is ACCESS to one's ENABLEMENT.

Which HAS TO BE accessed.

How?

We access said enablement BY FAITH.

It is FAITH over the various IMAGINATIONS and FEELINGS the flesh traffics its LIE in.

Paul is talking about how said ENABLEMENT is tapped INTO.

By Faith.

In other words, simply by taking God's Word on reality as FACT, over that representation of reality the flesh would have one believe is the Believer's reality - in - any - moment.

As in 'this guy just set me off...well, I will not be brought under the power of my flesh on that... "payback" is NOT of the Spirit - that is NOT who God says in His rightly divided Word He has made me in His Son...'

Faith over Feelings...

You want to know who is actually walking after the Spirit and who is not - including yourself?

That right there is both the lens, and the mirror.

No, IP, the thing is not automatic.

One has to DECIDE TO die DAILY...

One has to DECIDE DAILY to make one's CONSCIOUS focus the reality that is Romans 5: 6-8 - in each our stead.
 
john w

john w

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Interplanner said:
It is new because Christ performed it,....


When Rom 11 talks about the covenant of the act of the Gospel, quoting Isaiah, its because it is not just new nor eternal. It is Christ the covenant for the nations. That is what was brought in Christ, the Redeemer who came to Zion, and is both new and eternal, because the old covenant was never supposed to be the permenant thing. It can't be for it is not Christ.
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My I quote the Mayor? Huh?

It is new because Christ performed it, ??????

the covenant of the act of the Gospel,?????

It is Christ the covenant for the nations. That is what was brought in Christ,???


Are you getting a head start on "the Christmas lush?"




"permenant"

Teach us, real scholar....Please?
 
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