The Substitutionary and Representative Work of Christ on Our Behalf

[Robert Pate]

All that Jesus was and all that Jesus did was for our justification

To not believe that is to not believe the Gospel.

SUBSTITUTE: To put in the place of another person.

REPRESENTATIVE: To act on the behalf of another as their agent.

Jesus took our place on the cross, "For he has made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him" 2 Corinthians 5:21. We are the ones that should be crucified. We are the sinners, not Jesus. He was without sin, but in the Gospel Jesus takes our sins upon himself and becomes sin for us. Here is the grace of God in the Gospel. Jesus willingly atones for our sins and the sins of the whole world, 1 John 2:2. If Jesus had not atoned for our sins and the sins of the whole world no one would be saved. As far as God is concerned our sins and the sins of the whole world have been abolished.

God has put to death the whole sinful Adamic race in the person of Jesus Christ, Romans 6:6. When Jesus died on the cross all of humanity died with him. "Therefore as by the offence of one (Adam) judgment came upon ALL MEN to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one THE FREE GIFT came upon ALL MEN unto justification of life" Romans 5:18. Not just some men, but ALL MEN, have been reconciled to God by Jesus Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

The law has been fulfilled and abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Sin, death and the devil have been destroyed. When Jesus came out of Joseph's new tomb our new humanity came out with him. We are now new creations in Jesus Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:17. This great FREE GIFT of salvation is ours by faith alone. It is by faith alone because it is by Christ alone. Jesus is the one that has perfected us, "We are complete in him" Colossians 2:10. No one needs to be predestinated, no one needs to be made holy or join the Catholic church. All one needs to do is accept God's great free gift of salvation that has been provided by Jesus Christ, Ephesians 2:8.

 

[jamie]

As far as God is concerned our sins and the sins of the whole world have been abolished.

Good, so there is no further judgment, right?

No sins would equal no judgment and Jesus has already lived our life for us, is that what you believe?

:think:

 

[Robert Pate]

Good, so there is no further judgment, right?

No sins would equal no judgment and Jesus has already lived our life for us, is that what you believe?

:think:

There is no condemnation for those who are in Christ, Romans 8:1.

To be "In Christ" means that you are trusting in HIS righteousness and in HIS atonement for your sins, Romans 8:1. Plus nothing.

We shall ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:10. Probably to see if you have faith or to see if you have religion.

 

[jamie]

We shall ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ, 2 Corinthians 5:10.

If there is no sin then what is the purpose of the judgment?

 

[Robert Pate]

If there is no sin then what is the purpose of the judgment?

Only those that are "In Christ" and have received God's great free gift of salvation are saved and have been reconciled unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:18, 19.

To be saved you must enter into the faith.

Those that have not entered into the faith will be found in their sins. Their sins will be imputed back to them, Romans 4:8.

It was necessary for Jesus to atone for the sins of the world and to make salvation available for everyone, Hebrews 2:9. Nothing is ours if it is not received by faith.

 

[john w]

The law has been fulfilled and abolished, Ephesians 2:15.

No, it has not been abolished, and "fulfilled," abolished," are not synonymous terms-you keep spamming that, and misinterpreting Ephesians 2:15 KJV.

Pate:

- Murder, theft,lying..............................................................................are all OK, as there is no law, as it was allegedly abolished, to condemn them,

-everyone is saved, as when there is no law, there is no trangression, and sin is not imputed, where there is no law.

-the lost cannot come to know what sin is, and the law is not a schoolmaster, to bring them to Christ, as it was abolished....

 

[Robert Pate]

No, it has not been abolished, and "fulfilled," abolished," are not synonymous terms-you keep spamming that, and misinterpreting Ephesians 2:15 KJV.

Pate:

- Murder, theft,lying..............................................................................are all OK, as there is no law, as it was allegedly abolished, to condemn them,

-everyone is saved, as when there is no law, there is no trangression, and sin is not imputed, where there is no law.

-the lost cannot come to know what sin is, and the law is not a schoolmaster, to bring them to Christ, as it was abolished....

For the Christian the law has been abolished just like the scripture says.

"Having abolished in his flesh the enmity; EVEN THE LAW OF COMMANDMENTS contained in the ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man making peace" Ephesians 2:15.

This also goes with...

"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances (The law) that was against us , which was contrary to us and TOOK IT OUT OF THE WAY, nailing it to his cross" Colossians 2:14.

THIS IS ONLY FOR CHRISTIANS, all other will be judged by the law and condemned.

Where there is law there is judgment. Christians are not under any law.

 

[john w]

For the Christian the law has been abolished just like the scripture says.

"Having abolished in his flesh the enmity; EVEN THE LAW OF COMMANDMENTS contained in the ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man making peace" Ephesians 2:15.

1. Deceit. You did not say in your "argument," slick,"For the Christian the law has been abolished just like the scripture says."



You said:
"The law has been fulfilled and abolished,"



2. And the scripture does say, slick one, that "THE LAW OF COMMANDMENTS contained in the ordinances" was abolished in the flesh, but that is not saying the law of Moses, God's holy law, the laws against theft, murder, rape, coveting..........................have been abolished Pate, as you satanically made up, misinterpret.

This also goes with...

"Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances (The law) that was against us , which was contrary to us and TOOK IT OUT OF THE WAY, nailing it to his cross" Colossians 2:14.

THIS IS ONLY FOR CHRISTIANS, all other will be judged by the law and condemned.


Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances (The law)

Where there is law there is judgment. Christians are not under any law.

"the handwriting of ordinances (The law)"-you


"the handwriting of ordinances" is not the law, Pate, as you assert, biblically illiterate one. You changed the scripture. "the handwriting of ordinances" is a reference to the sin debt, "the charge," the notice of the, so to speak, "certified copy of an execution order," being nailed to the cross-not the law, itself.

Yes, Christians are not under any law, a a "rule of life," but that is not equivalent to asserting that the law was abolished, as you made up-it still serves its purpose, as it always has. Through the law, is the knowledge of sin, and still functions, to bring the lost to Christ-today, as it did in Egypt, as it always has/does today:

Romans 3:20 KJV Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Galatians 3 KJV
24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Read it-"that"


RPateut with Romans 3:20 KJV, Galatians 3:24-25 KJV.



I know that's quite deep, Pate. You need to back up, and get out of this ditch, that you are in. When you are in a hole, quit digging.

 

[Robert Pate]

You don't want to accept what the scriptures are saying.

To be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10.

This is why Jesus took us out from under the law, by fulfilling and abolishing the law. We are now under grace. To be under the law is to be under judgment.

 

[jamie]

The law has been fulfilled and abolished, Ephesians 2:15. Sin, death and the devil have been destroyed.

If sin has been destroyed then there is no sin, no judgment for no sin and with death destroyed we all have eternal life, right?

 

[jamie]

The law has been fulfilled and abolished, Ephesians 2:15.

Why didn't Jesus' apostles know that? Were they not in the loop?

If the law had been fulfilled and abolished surely someone would have mentioned that in the Acts 15 discussions.

Robert, you have created for yourself a fantasy. Dream on while you may.

 

[Robert Pate]

If sin has been destroyed then there is no sin, no judgment for no sin and with death destroyed we all have eternal life, right?

Wrong.

Only those who have come to Christ as repentant sinners to be saved by him will be saved.

All others are under the law and will be judged by the law and condemned.

Jesus had to atone for everyone's sins or no one could be saved, Hebrews 2:9.

Nothing is ours until it is received by faith.

 

[jamie]

Only those who have come to Christ as repentant sinners to be saved by him will be saved.

You said, "Sin, death and the devil have been destroyed."

If death has been destroyed then everyone is saved. Make up your mind. Which is it?

 

[Robert Pate]

Why didn't Jesus' apostles know that? Were they not in the loop?

If the law had been fulfilled and abolished surely someone would have mentioned that in the Acts 15 discussions.

Robert, you have created for yourself a fantasy. Dream on while you may.

They did.

There was a dispute, Acts 15:9, 10.

If you want to be under the law and judged by the law that is your choice.

As for me, I will continue to believe that Jesus removed me from the law, Colossians 2:14.

 

[Robert Pate]

You said, "Sin, death and the devil have been destroyed."

If death has been destroyed then everyone is saved. Make up your mind. Which is it?

You just don't get it. Sin, death and the devil have been destroyed, Romans 6:6 because Jesus is Lord. Remember, Nothing is yours if it is not received by faith.

 

[Ben Masada]

You don't want to accept what the scriptures are saying.

Not the gospel of Paul. That's a no, no for a Jew.

To be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10.

That's why we cannot believe the gospel of Paul. For us, to be under the Law is to be under God's grace. Had not the Lord used of His grace to give us His Law, we would be living under the law of the jungle, unable to live in society. We must praise the Lord every day for having given us His Law from His grace.

This is why Jesus took us out from under the law, by fulfilling and abolishing the law. We are now under grace. To be under the law is to be under judgment.

Sorry Robert but you are implying that Jesus was an idiot to abolish the Law and next to teach us that to achieve salvation, we must listen to "Moses" aka the Law. (Luke 16:29-31) Please, read the quotes I have given you and stop living under the illusion that you can live without the Law.

 

[jamie]

There was a dispute, Acts 15:9, 10.

There is nothing in those two verses about Jesus abolishing the law. If he had there would not have been a need for the conference.

Did you not know the law in question was the Law of Moses? (Acts 15:5)

Some times you say that law was abolished and some times you say people are judged by it. That's goofy.

 

[john w]

You don't want to accept what the scriptures are saying.

To be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10.

This is why Jesus took us out from under the law, by fulfilling and abolishing the law. We are now under grace. To be under the law is to be under judgment.

How is it possible, to be under a law, that does not exist, was abolished, biblical buffoon?

Pate: Well, uh, urr.....

 

[jamie]

You just don't get it. Sin, death and the devil have been destroyed, Romans 6:6 because Jesus is Lord.

Who are you trying to fool? The subject in Romans 6:6 is our old body of sin being destroyed.

Jesus dying in the first century does not automatically make everyone in our century a new person. It's more intimate than that.

 

[Robert Pate]

Who are you trying to fool? The subject in Romans 6:6 is our old body of sin being destroyed.

Jesus dying in the first century does not automatically make everyone in our century a new person. It's more intimate than that.

Jesus is Lord. The reason that Jesus is Lord is because he has victoriously defeated sin, death and the devil, Colossians 2:15.

In God's eyes, Jesus is God's new creation and our new humanity.

"If any man be "In Christ" he is a new creation: old things have passed away; behold ALL THINGS have become new" 2 Corinthians 5:17.