THE JEWISH CURSE OF DANIEL

OCTOBER23

OCTOBER23

New member
Why does The Talmudic Law contain this Rabbinical Curse ???
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"May the bones of the hands and the bones of the fingers decay and decompose,

of him who turns the pages of the book of Daniel,

to find out the time of Daniel 9:24-27,

and may his memory rot from off the face of the earth forever .

Talmudic Law, p. 978, Section 2, Line 28."

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D

daqq

Well-known member
OCTOBER23 said:
Why does The Talmudic Law contain this Rabbinical Curse ???
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"May the bones of the hands and the bones of the fingers decay and decompose,

of him who turns the pages of the book of Daniel,

to find out the time of Daniel 9:24-27,

and may his memory rot from off the face of the earth forever .

Talmudic Law, p. 978, Section 2, Line 28."

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Click to expand...

Perhaps because at that late date they were already hooked by Theodotion and the Latin Vulgate? If you look at a polyglot with the main texts side-by-side perhaps you may see that Theodotion, the Latin Vulgate, and what later became the Masoretic Text, all seem to be in agreement, (because it appears the Vulgate and Masoretic came from Theodotion) despite the oldest and more reliable Old Greek Septuagint Texts which were rejected by the so-called church fathers in favor of Theodotion the elaborator-fabricator extraordinaire, (that is, Theodotion when it comes to the book of Daniel in the Septuagint, which version was inserted in the place of the Old Greek Septuagint version of Daniel). At the following link there are two columns for the Septuagint and that is because the one that matches closely to the Vulgate and the Masoretic is not the original Septuagint but the later Theodotion version:

Exhibit A:
http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/poly/dan009.htm

However, I can understand it any way you want to see it, thanks be to the Testimony of Messiah Yeshua, (Nagiyd-Commander of the Covenant). :)
 
D

daqq

Well-known member
chair said:
This "source" isn't real. The Talmud isn't organized by pages, sections and lines like this.
Click to expand...

It looks like it might be out a book once titled "Talmudic Law" or something to that effect. The only thing I find in an initial search is the following from the Babylonian Talmud:

Sanhedrin 97b

It has been taught; R. Nathan said: This verse pierces and descends to the very abyss:11 For the vision is yet for an appointed time, but at the end it shall speak, and not lie: though he tarry, wait for him; because it will surely come, it will not tarry.12 Not as our Masters, who interpreted the verse, until a time and times and the dividing of time;13 nor as R. Simlai who expounded, Thou feedest them with the bread of tears; and givest them tears to drink a third time;14 nor as R. Akiba who expounded, Yet once, it is a little while, and I will shake the heavens, and the earth:15 but the first dynasty [sc. the Hasmonean] shall last seventy years, the second [the Herodian], fifty two, and the reign of Bar Koziba16 two and a half years.17

What is meant by 'but at the end it shall speak [we-yafeah] and not lie?' — R. Samuel b. Nahmani said in the name of R. Jonathan: Blasted be18 the bones of those who calculate the end.19 For they would say, since the predetermined time has arrived, and yet he has not come, he will never come. But [even so], wait for him, as it is written, Though he tarry, wait for him. Should you say, We look forward [to his coming] but He does not: therefore Scripture saith, And therefore will the Lord wait, that he may be gracious unto you, and therefore will he be exalted, that he may have mercy upon you.20 But since we look forward to it, and He does likewise, what delays [his coming]? — The Attribute of Justice delays it.21 But since the Attribute of Justice delays it, why do we await it? — To be rewarded [for hoping], as it is written, blessed are all they that wait for him.22
http://www.come-and-hear.com/sanhedrin/sanhedrin_97.html#PARTb
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And if that is the source, well, as may be plainly seen, it is taken out of context, (as usual). Funny thing is the warning in the above is about date setting and the disappointment which comes after the failure. I wonder if the OP has ever done such a thing? :crackup: :chuckle:

:sheep:
 
Elia

Elia

Well-known member
OCTOBER23 said:
Why does The Talmudic Law contain this Rabbinical Curse ???
------------------------------------------------------------------
"May the bones of the hands and the bones of the fingers decay and decompose,

of him who turns the pages of the book of Daniel,

to find out the time of Daniel 9:24-27,

and may his memory rot from off the face of the earth forever .

Talmudic Law, p. 978, Section 2, Line 28."
Click to expand...

Bs"d

Never heard of a book called "Talmudic Law".

Probably made up.

If it is in the Talmud, then give tractate and page.

Anyway, Daniel 9 is really not difficult.

Here I explain what's going there: https://sites.google.com/site/777mountzion/daniel9



"For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of Y-H-W-H our God for ever and ever.".
Micah 4:5
 
OCTOBER23

OCTOBER23

New member
Looks like we have to wait and see during the next 10 years

if JESUS will come and the Sky will Fall.

SKYFALL
This is the END - close your eyes and Count to 10.
 
D

daqq

Well-known member
OCTOBER23 said:
Looks like we have to wait and see during the next 10 years

if JESUS will come and the Sky will Fall.

SKYFALL
This is the END - close your eyes and Count to 10.
Click to expand...

"Blasted be the bones of those who calculate the end." :devil:

:luigi:
 
I

iamaberean

New member
Elia said:
Bs"d

Never heard of a book called "Talmudic Law".

Probably made up.

If it is in the Talmud, then give tractate and page.

Anyway, Daniel 9 is really not difficult.

Here I explain what's going there: https://sites.google.com/site/777mountzion/daniel9
"For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of Y-H-W-H our God for ever and ever.".
Micah 4:5
Click to expand...

I go along with your interpretation of Daniel 9 where is says:This speaks about king Agrippas, the last Jewish king at the end of the second Temple period.

"and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary" This speaks about the Roman Titus, who ordered the destruction of the second Temple.

The Roman army did destroy the city and the temple. Jesus had told his disciples that this would happen in their generation, and it did.

I look at it like this:
When the children of Israel, led by Moses, came to the promise land the scouts came back saying they would not be able to possess it. Because of their unbelief, they would wander in the wilderness 40 years and not enter into the promise land.

When Jesus led his people to the new promise land, the Jews did not believe him. For that they would wander in the wilderness (Old Covenant) for 40 years and would not enter into the new promise land (New Covenant).
From the death of Jesus in 31 AD to 70 AD would be just about right for that generation to come to an end, 39 years.
 
F

Faithfullone

New member
From “Epistle to Yemen” Iggeret Teiman, translated 1952 by Boaz Cohen; published in New York by American Academy for Jewish Research (http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Epistle_to_Yemen); Page 12
Inasmuch as Daniel has proclaimed the matter a deep secret, our sages have interdicted the calculation of the time of the future redemption, or the reckoning of the period of the advent of the Messiah, because the masses might be mystified and bewildered should the Messiah fail to appear as forecast.
The rabbis invoked God to frustrate and destroy those who seek to determine precisely the advent of the Messiah, because the masses might be mystified and bewildered should the Messiah fail to appear as forecast.
The rabbis invoked God to frustrate and destroy those who seek to determine precisely the advent of the Messianic era, because they are a stumbling block to the people, and that is why they uttered the imprecation "May the calculators of the final redemption come to grief" (Sanhedrin 97b).
Source http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Epistle_to_Yemen/XII

“Rabbi Maimonides, the preeminent medieval Jewish philosopher and one of the greatest Torah scholars of the Middle Ages, said this about Daniel 9:24-27 – “Daniel has made known to us the knowledge of the end times. However, since they are secret, the wise rabbis have barred the calculation of the days of Messiah’s coming so that the untutored populace will not be led astray when they see that the End Times have already come but there is no sign of the Messiah" (Igeret Teiman,Chapter 3 p.24.)
Apparently, Maimonides believed that Daniel did accurately predict in advance events related to the “end times,” including the date of the coming of the Messiah, but believed that they were “secret,” or not understandable, and thus believed it best that the rabbis not teach Daniel chapter nine to their congregants lest they be dismayed if they believed they saw these events happening and the Messiah did not appear. A Sage said: "May the curse of heaven fall upon those who calculate the date of the advent of the Messiah, and thus create political and social unrest among the people."( Sanhedrin, 97b.)
Sanhedrin, 97 b is an excerpt from the Babylonian Talmud, a collection of ancient Rabbinic writings containing the basis of religious authority in Orthodox Judaism (the religion of those Jewish people who adhere most strictly to traditional Jewish beliefs and practices). Concerning Daniel chapter nine, Sanhedrin, 97b indicates that many rabbis believed that calculating the date of the coming of the Messiah might cause political and social unrest among the Jewish people, and thus thought it best not to perform the calculation. In fact, they felt so strongly about this that they pronounced a curse on anyone who calculated the date of Messiah’s coming.
“Rabbis after the time of Christ have pronounced a curse on anyone who would attempt to calculate the dates of this chapter.” (Talmud Sanhedrin 97b, Soncino ed., p. 659.)
Talmud Sanhedrin 97b implies that some rabbis did recognize that Daniel chapter nine predicted the time of Yeshua’s (Jesus’) death, and were so concerned that this might cause Jewish people to recognize Yeshua as the Messiah that they pronounced a curse on those who calculated the dates revealed in Daniel chapter nine.”
Source: http://www.chosenpeople.com/main/pdf/The-Seventy-Weeks-Of-Daniel.pdf
 
A

AgainstAll

New member
51.

Matthew 24:27
Luke 12:39
Luke 17:34
{ Matthew 24:15-18 }
Jeremiah 51:51
Ezekiel 44:7
1 Corinthians 15:51-58
John 8:51-58
Matthew 24:48-51

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Matthew (24:27) 24+27 = 51
Luke (12:39) 12 + 39
Luke (17:34) 17 + 34 ...

{ Matthew 24:15-18 }

Jeremiah 51:51
{ The prophecy of Jeremiah 51 closes on verse 58! ( Jeremiah 51:58-59 )
All of Jeremiah 51 is relevant to this year declaration! ( Jeremiah 51:44 ) }
Ezekiel (44:7)

1 Corinthians 15:51-58
John 8:51-58

Matthew ( 24:48-(51) ) { 2(4+4=8-8=0)51 }

It is what all the verses themselves say that give all this the most weight.

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One of the works of the Messiah = "to preach the acceptable year of the Lord" Luke 4:19

"he that believes on me, the works that I do shall he do also" John 14:12

1 Thessalonians 5:20 1 Corinthians 14:3

"For ye brethren are not in darkness that that day should overtake you as a thief"
1 Thessalonians 5:4

"If therefore you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief,
and you will not know what hour I will come upon you" Revelation 3:3

We are not in darkness, therefore let us be patient and watch.

For the years of our patience are at hand; Revelation 13:1-10 Revelation 13:3 Revelation 17:8

There are 35 years in between the two beats.
 
B

Ben Masada

New member
OCTOBER23 said:
Why does The Talmudic Law contain this Rabbinical Curse ???
------------------------------------------------------------------
"May the bones of the hands and the bones of the fingers decay and decompose,

of him who turns the pages of the book of Daniel,

to find out the time of Daniel 9:24-27,

and may his memory rot from off the face of the earth forever .

Talmudic Law, p. 978, Section 2, Line 28."

=======================
Click to expand...

Don't pay attention to them. This does not make sense at all.
 
B

Ben Masada

New member
OCTOBER23 said:
Looks like we have to wait and see during the next 10 years

if JESUS will come and the Sky will Fall.

SKYFALL
This is the END - close your eyes and Count to 10.
Click to expand...

Try another 2000 years. Then, you can close your eyes and count the Jews up to 10. As long as there are at least
ten, there will be no end. (Genesis 18:32)
 
A

AgainstAll

New member
Try another 2000 years. Then, you can close your eyes and count the Jews up to 10. As long as there are at least
ten, there will be no end. (Genesis 18:32)
Click to expand...

Romans 2:28-29

Isaiah 65:11-15
 
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