Jesus taught existence after death

[way 2 go]

Jesus taught existence after physical death

Luk 16:22 The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried,
Luk 16:23 and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side.
Luk 16:24 And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in anguish in this flame.’

Abraham, Lazarus and The rich man all dead Physically.

The rich man is also dead spiritually and in the place of the dead. Rev 20:13

There is:
1 spiritual death Mat 8:22
2 physical death Mat 8:22
3 death as a place Rev 20:13

 

[steko]

Sure nuf, did!

 

[keypurr]

What is the state of the Dead?

Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion forever in any thing that is done under the sun.

Psa 146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day.

All will be raised

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurre2ction of damnation.

 

[way 2 go]

What is the state of the Dead?

What is the state of the spirits of the dead?

Jesus taught existence after physical death
Luk 16:24 And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in anguish in this flame.’

Ecc 9:5 For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
Ecc 9:6 Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion forever in any thing that is done under the sun.

all about here under the sun

Psa 146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
Psa 146:4 His breath goeth forth, he returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish.

agrees with Jesus in Luk 16:19-31

Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day.

yup David's physical body is in the ground

All will be raised

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Rev 6:9 And when He had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the Word of God, and for the testimony which they held
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, Until when, Master, holy and true, do You not judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?

Joh 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
Joh 5:29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.

yup physical bodies will be raised

 

[keypurr]

What is the state of the spirits of the dead?

Jesus taught existence after physical death
Luk 16:24 And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in anguish in this flame.’



all about here under the sun

agrees with Jesus in Luk 16:19-31


yup David's physical body is in the ground



Rev 6:9 And when He had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the Word of God, and for the testimony which they held
Rev 6:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, Until when, Master, holy and true, do You not judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell on the earth?


yup physical bodies will be raised

Amen, he will raise us, but until then there will be no life for us after we die.

 

[keypurr]

What is the state of the spirits of the dead?

Jesus taught existence after physical death
Luk 16:24 And he called out, ‘Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus to dip the end of his finger in water and cool my tongue, for I am in anguish in this flame.

Jesus used many Visions in his teachings.

The Rich Man and Lazarus
Luk 16:19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day:
Luk 16:20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores,
Luk 16:21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores.
Luk 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;
Luk 16:23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
Luk 16:24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
Luk 16:25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented.
Luk 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.
Luk 16:27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house:
Luk 16:28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.
Luk 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.
Luk 16:30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent.
Luk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

 

[glorydaz]

Keypurr thinks Jesus deliberately tried to lead people astray about the afterlife. :nono:

That wasn't a "vision". It was a teaching moment. Not fiction, but fact as always.

 

[beameup]

What is the state of the Dead?

Act 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulcher is with us unto this day.

Jesus: "have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spoke unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living." - from Mark 12:26-27

"plucking verses out of context" is a JW attribute

 

[jamie]

yup physical bodies will be raised

Are physical bodies corruptible?

"So also is the resurrection of the dead. The body is sown in corruption, it is raised in incorruption. It is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised in power. It is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body." (1 Corinthians 15:42-44)

 

[jamie]

Jesus: "have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spoke unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living." - from Mark 12:26-27

Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob have eternal life, they are asleep, not dead.

 

[jamie]

Jesus taught the people in parables.

"All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them." (Matthew 13:34)

The rich man symbolizes the Judeans, the poor man symbolizes the Gentiles.

 

[way 2 go]

Jesus taught the people in parables.

"All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them." (Matthew 13:34)

Jesus spoke about the kingdom of Heaven in parables
Luk 16:19-31 is not about the kingdom of Heaven


Mat 13:10 And the disciples said to Him, Why do You speak to them in parables?
Mat 13:11 He answered and said to them, Because it is given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of Heaven, but it is not given to them.

The rich man symbolizes the Judeans, the poor man symbolizes the Gentiles.

his name is Lazarus not the "poor man" Jesus knows Lazarus

 

[jamie]

his name is Lazarus not the "poor man" Jesus knows Lazarus

Lazarus laid at the gate of the rich man. He was full of sores and died.

 

[glorydaz]

Lazarus laid at the gate of the rich man. He was full of sores and died.

Jesus never used actual names in His parables. Luke 16 isn't a parable.

 

[glorydaz]

Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob have eternal life, they are asleep, not dead.

They aren't actually asleep. They say that because the dead look like they are sleeping.

 

[way 2 go]

Amen, he will raise us, but until then there will be no life for us after we die.

:nono:
Php 1:23 For I am pressed together by the two: having a desire to depart and to be with Christ, which is far better.

 

[jamie]

Jesus never used actual names in His parables. Luke 16 isn't a parable.

Good point. The rich man's grave was on fire.

Well, don't get buried next to a rich man.

He will keep you up all night wanting tomb service.

 

[jamie]

They aren't actually asleep. They say that because the dead look like they are sleeping.

It looked that way to Paul.

"Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed" (1 Corinthians 15:51)

 

[keypurr]

Jesus taught the people in parables.

"All these things Jesus spoke to the multitude in parables; and without a parable He did not speak to them." (Matthew 13:34)

The rich man symbolizes the Judeans, the poor man symbolizes the Gentiles.

Jamie they will never get it.

 

[way 2 go]

the dead standing

Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.