Jesus and the Law of Moses, answering the world's problems.

[Jacob]

Have you ever been completely sold out to an ideology? For example, a pacifist that does not believe in the death penalty? How can we answer the world's problems? We must look at big picture ideas and break them down to see if they are sensible. Like with the Law of Moses. Obviously there were wars and the Law of Moses has the death penalty. But if with Jesus it is abolished or Jesus is in addition to the Law of Moses, well these are separate ideas that may affect our commitments in life. That is, what we preach and what we are willing to die for, even without giving up a fight if necessary.

Do you have a show of force? Do you have the gospel? Are you the government? Do you believe that as an individual you either serve Jesus or you are a part of the government or you have a say in the world? I would like to solve some things. And they involve more than Religion in the church or online. I summarily believe that the Bible is the Word of God. I believe that the Tanakh is inspired by God. And I think I may have just adopted or come back to the Trinity.

I am not involved in or with the military, but I am a Citizen of the United States of America with a Voice.

Peace is not weakness.

 

[Jacob]

Israel as a nation. Love your neighbor. Maybe this is thought of as your country man. Or, your fellow man. Or your fellow citizen. Else, unless love does not keep one from war, one would not go to war against anyone (a foreign power, etc...).

 

[Jacob]

The Ten Commandments as a Law Code. There is more to the Law than the Ten Commandments, so I don't know what the Law Code is if there is one. But it is for the nation as a whole, and seems to include Gentiles (the Nations) as well.

 

[Jacob]

In Jesus we have forgiveness of sins. Now the Law may include mercy. But with forgiveness of sins in Jesus Christ we have something that the Law of Moses never offered. With that can we change the world?

 

[Jacob]

Sins.

Pick a sin and there is a punishment for it, a penalty (different from the lightness of being penalized). But in Jesus we have forgiveness of sins. So is there punishment of or for sins now? Can a person be completely changed without being punished? Must he grieve over his sin in repentance? He should have faith in God and Jesus. He should repent and turn to God. What law still has place today? Else governments have their authority from God but do not utilize God's Law. Because if the Law has not been abolished, governments should not be precluded from being godly in their enacting or enforcement of the Law. Should authorities punish according to God's Law or some other Law or guide or rule book?

 

[Jacob]

Adultery. This is more than having sex with a married member of the opposite sex, or even someone who is engaged if this would be considered adultery. It may be flirting. You don't have to be married to be guilty of it. Attracted to someone else and don't know if they are married? That is a grey area, because you wouldn't want to make a wrong move. But marriage is much more than attraction so be careful there too. Perhaps your marriage to someone can be arranged, like family and family or you and them depending on your situation. Certainly you may involve her parents if you are a man, in your plan. As for sin, don't. Don't sin. Get married rather than having sex and paying a dowry. Her father may not let you.

 

[Jacob]

War.

It doesn't make sense to just go to war. Sometimes there is a preexisting reason not known to everyone. But shouldn't it be a moral reason that can be known? I think so.

If someone threatens you, can you defend yourself? Or, should you lay down your arms or not have any to begin with and pursue peace? A strong show of force would be different. A person may not want to threaten back or be a threat to anyone.

Discipline and training go into what makes a warrior or going to war. You don't just kill people in war. Rather, instead, if a person sins, they should be called to account rather than things becoming a reason for war. How can one nation do this with another? If nothing happened nothing can or should be said in terms of war. Seek peace with everyone. If you can determine that something immoral has happened, you might inquire what has been done about it, not seeking war. A perceived threat may not be a threat at all.

So what if it is a crime committed in your own land? If one or the other implies the Law you should have a good grasp of the Law to begin with, whether it would be good or not to do something based on whether or not the Law has been abolished, etc.... Not taking matters into your own hand. Or if God made you an authority, and how would this happen?

 

[Jacob]

How do we leave room for the wrath of God, not doing anything?

 

[Jacob]

The speed limit. It is a rule, a law. Don't go over the speed limit. Why not? The speed limit is set by the governing authorities such that everyone is safe. We don't get to say I think people are safe I can go faster. So, there is a good reason for the speed limit, people's safety. It is a matter of life and death often, or so there are no injuries in the case of an accident. But if everyone is following the rules of the road then hopefully there are no accidents (vehicle collisions). Meaning, a slower speed makes it possible to make decisions that prevent an accident, not just the speed at which the vehicle was traveling at impact.

 

[Jacob]

Theology.

In our study of God we often study the Law or the Word of God or Scripture the Bible. We reach conclusions based upon our study. We make decisions based on what we learn, or in order to learn. What to read, what to study. So your interactions with someone else may involve more factors than even your own experience with the Bible.

 

[Jacob]

In the world but not of it.

You may realize that you are in the world but you are not of it. God has taught us that we are not of the world, those of us who are believers. But that does not mean that we are not in it. So do what makes sense according to what God would or does want you to do, if you do anything at all, and if you are confident in what is right and that it is God that is leading you. Try not to make a mistake with that, attributing something to God which you should not. With whether or not the Law of God the Law of Moses has been abolished, there is still the law of God just the question of the Law of Moses which was given to God's people the Israelites and is possibly for other believers as well. But if you don't know if the Law of Moses has been abolished or not or rather not then you shouldn't try to punish someone based upon it. Which makes it different for if people allow you to study it and whether or not we should live by it, honestly. It is something that we are up against possibly with authorities though I am not sure but the other thing is ignorance. I am not in a position of authority for example, but as a commoner not being of England or a feudal system etc... I am just a person a citizen yes but without rights to hurt or harm someone else and yet with the ability to make decisions should I be required to. The point is, if I have to think for myself am I equipped to do so or even allowed to? Can I prevent a death or defend someone from a threat to life or limb? Perhaps as a Christian we should allow people to suffer harm, even someone other than yourself whom you may not defend in self-defense. To love or to be harmed. If you are asked to do something like carry a Roman Soldier's gear (are there any Romans any more, the Roman world being a thing of the past) for a certain length, would you go further? Just being nice or being threatened by something? Because peace and war or weapons are an interesting thing, and if the gear is not weapons but the person is or is not fully equipped to carry out his duties.

 

[Jacob]

Though we are in the world we do not war according to the world.

Our weapons are strong enough to bring down strongholds. It is a spiritual battle, not a physical one. When you war according to God's terms spiritually if that is all there is even, it may be prayer or a kind word to help someone. Better that than seeking someone else's harm. There are things that are not a threat to anyone, and we can use them spending our time with them. Maybe I will never be equipped for battle. Rather, we can fight for peace in other ways.

 

[Jacob]

A penalty. A war.

If someone is penalized for something, that is different than if there is something that needs to be rectified. A show of force is different from if a person can encourage another person to do right. But if someone holes up or begins hurting more then their punishment is not just late in coming. And yet, we are of a different kingdom. If you live by the sword you die by the sword. So then what of Godly enforcement? For governments have been appointed by God and do not bear the sword for nothing. Then are you or I in the government, and the less for things that really matter like helping people to understand the truth of God through good teaching and governance?

 

[Jacob]

You can respond to any post of your choice.

 

[ok doser]

You can respond to any post of your choice.

:think:

How is this different than what the pizza guy was doing?

because reasons

 

[Jacob]

:think:



because reasons

Where does fzappa13 come from here? I don't see that in this thread but I wonder where it came from and why? At least why did you include it here? Thanks.

 

[Jacob]

:think:



because reasons

You quoted someone else so yes they can see this thread, but as for the content I finally followed your post. Interesting thread title.

 

[Jacob]

In general what sin law crime crimes are is punished or penalized in the world? Yes, people have different laws.

For example, for homosexuality we have the Torah and Judaism, Christianity which includes the New Testament, and Islam with Sharia Law. Just learned about that.

 

[Jacob]

Is a person's reason, such as myself, for being in support of the Law of Moses even while I know Jesus because of my sin? Because Jesus forgives sin and sins, but I feel that I must be guilty enough to go through punishment or receive penalty. Otherwise would preaching the Law help others to know the Law so that they don't transgress it or so that they learn that they have done so?

 

[Jacob]

Is a person's reason, such as myself, for being in support of the Law of Moses even while I know Jesus because of my sin? Because Jesus forgives sin and sins, but I feel that I must be guilty enough to go through punishment or receive penalty. Otherwise would preaching the Law help others to know the Law so that they don't transgress it or so that they learn that they have done so?

Jesus spoke positively about the Law.