ECT If Christ already returned and nothing remains to be fulfilled...
- Thread starter musterion
- Start date
The question that destroys preterism completely
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
The verse says nothing about Jesus going back to Heaven for 7 years.
LA
The verse says nothing about Jesus going back to Heaven for 7 years.
LA
Interplanner
Well-known member
He may have simply meant that he was going to welcome them in his new community of believers and his mission. He did say other things like that in Jn 13-17, such as, when the Spirit of truth has come, meaning the Pentecost event, even though we know at this distance that the Spirit was doing various things already.
It is not a complicated thing to realize that Mt24A was about the 1st century but the end of the world was not immediately after that. A and B, on either side of v29, are different.
There are things to be fufilled like the NHNE, but there is nothing Judaic that needs to be fulfilled. The NT simply doesn't speak of that.
It is not a complicated thing to realize that Mt24A was about the 1st century but the end of the world was not immediately after that. A and B, on either side of v29, are different.
There are things to be fufilled like the NHNE, but there is nothing Judaic that needs to be fulfilled. The NT simply doesn't speak of that.
musterion
Well-known member
You just lost.
Your system is clear but to you.
You go from a "may have" this or that, to "its not complicated to realize" such and so.
And THAT is EXACTLY the rationale of men who, having learned that rationale from endless books "about" cannot but base there own resulting error on.
All that remains is for such to parrot it in their own writings "about."
Thus, here you are.
For THAT is EXACTLY the rationale of those who OVER rely on books "about" for their OWN rationalizing "about."
I saw this years ago, while reading all sorts of books "about" on all sorts of subjects from life in general.
As a result, I was already well aware of the following the very first time I picked up what I soon came to realize was the same error on the part of most who write supposedly "Bible" based commentaries.
It is also the same reason behind why I am so easily able to see gaping holes in the supposed Mad some hold to.
Because I automatically look at things in patterns and their recurrence (repetition) whenever I am attempting to sort out one thing or another no matter the subject in life...I could not help but automatically do the same when I first began reading books supposedly "about" or supposedly based on "the Bible."
And I was shocked for a time by that.
At the crass, willfully irresponsible and woefull ignorant to their purported task or supposed "calling" so many supposedly "Bible based" writers allow themselves to be where their actual "source" is concerned.
Your 40 years has only seared your conscience from seeing what I was fortunate to see was a crock men are prone to way before I ever even picked a book supposedly "about" the Bible
If this sounds arrogant; so be it.
The ignorant always take for arrogant ANY stance their ever ignorant reading into a thing cannot but also read into another's confident clarity.
Start being as unrelentingly vigorous against your own rationale as I continue to be towards my own (rationale) - especially towards my own (rationale) - focus on yours for a time, rather than on these fool posts of yours purporting to expose what you are clearly clueless about...and you will begin to find a voice that is actually "true."
I know, I know...you had hoped to sway one more poster to come and play with you in your ever sinking...sand.
I told you you are beyond help at this point, these 40 years later...
:doh:
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
I appreciate the Holfordian diplomacy you employed in this post.
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Once again....so?
The first mention and basis of the New Covenant/NT is Jer 31:31-40 and is thoroughly Judaic/Israelic.
Why would all the details of the future for Israel need to be rewritten in the NT writings when they are more than adequately covered in the OT writings?
And why would one such as Paul need to likewise cover all of prophecy in detail again when he plainly tells us that the nation of Israel has been set aside until the fullness of the gentiles be come in? OT/NT is all one book. Ground that has already been thoroughly covered does not need to be re-covered. It's all one book...the Bible.
Paul writes particularly concerning the Body of Christ and his gospel of grace to the nations...different stuff.
What Paul writes doesn't cancel GOD's irrevocable promises to national Israel.
Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Jer 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:
Jer 31:33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Jer 31:34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.
Jer 31:35 Thus saith the LORD, which giveth the sun for a light by day, and the ordinances of the moon and of the stars for a light by night, which divideth the sea when the waves thereof roar; The LORD of hosts is his name:
Jer 31:36 If those ordinances depart from before me, saith the LORD, then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.
Jer 31:37 Thus saith the LORD; If heaven above can be measured, and the foundations of the earth searched out beneath, I will also cast off all the seed of Israel for all that they have done, saith the LORD.
Jer 31:38 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that the city shall be built to the LORD from the tower of Hananeel unto the gate of the corner.
Jer 31:39 And the measuring line shall yet go forth over against it upon the hill Gareb, and shall compass about to Goath.
Jer 31:40 And the whole valley of the dead bodies, and of the ashes, and all the fields unto the brook of Kidron, unto the corner of the horse gate toward the east, shall be holy unto the LORD; it shall not be plucked up, nor thrown down any more for ever.
musterion
Well-known member
POTY right there, brother.
I hope it was Halfordian enough. :noid:
SaulToPaul 2
Well-known member
Halford, the singer of Judas Priest?
Uh... I thought he rode with Frankie Lee and John Wesley Harding. :idunno:
musterion
Well-known member
My older brother was a metal head back in the '80s (still is). When he was 16 or so, he won Halford's black leather biker/cop hat in a contest. When we got it he beamed with pride and showed it to Dad, along with an album cover with Halford wearing it, but Dad promptly said only queers dress like that. Years later I laughed and sent my brother the news clip that Halford finally came out of the closet. My brother is a lib so he's brain dead, it didn't matter.
Great post.
It is also obvious throughout both Paul's writings, and in Acts in light of Paul's writings, that he often went over much that he would then later mention in his writings as ground he had gone into great detail on.
One example of many, being what 2 Thessalonians 2 reveals about what he had gone into in Acts 17, that is not mentioned in Acts 17 - that he had gone over much more than merely proving that Jesus had been "very Christ" - that he had gone over the delay in Daniel's 70th week with the Thessalonians.
musterion
Well-known member
Interesting, sad.
LORD send light!
Been around and around with him many times but he thoroughly rejected the Gospel of grace in favor of his own idiot's blend of New Age/Ecclesiastes/other nonsense. So I told him we were done with any such conversation because it's a complete waste of time. Plus, he's one of those with a creepy pathological LOVE of arguing endlessly, just for it's own sake, completely irrational and spooky...we think he fried himself messing with drugs around the same time he won that hat.
The very reason that I so often use the word 'Messiah' and show folks that 'Christ/Christos' cannot be disassociated with Israel's Messiah and all that is promised concerning Him. So many lift even the word 'Christ' out of its' 'Israelic/Judaic' context.