Creation vs. Evolution

[gcthomas]

Energy is not entropy. What you need to do is show how the sun increases DNA's complexity.

Why do you feel that is a remotely important or interesting question?

 

[seehigh]

Tell that to your local junkyard dealer; the proud owner of rotting classic cars sitting in his outback.

So you refuse to understand that the second law of thermodynamics applies only to close systems?

MichaelCadry,
re: "The virgin birth is the claim that Mary was impregnated by the Holy Spirit."


To add to noguru's comment, the Immaculate Conception is a term that is used by the Catholic Church to refer to their notion that the Messiah's mother was free from original sin from the beginning of her conception in the womb of her mother. However, it is frequently incorrectly used to refer to the conception of the Messiah.

Oh the irony is too much sometimes.

:rotfl:

You have been shown your error in regard to your understanding of asexual reproduction to sexual reproduction, yet you continue to repeat the error. And that is only one example.

The amazing thing is that you do not even seem to recognize your deceit.

Maybe, could be, appears to be. That is good science?? Is that your "empirical evidence"??

Are you asexual?? How come?

For crying out loud Michael I do not believe in your God. Please get that through you thick skull. I'm not angry with your God or anything like that. I simply do not believe it is real any more than the flying spaghetti monster is real, hens the comparison.







Michael, your ignorance of science has been well and truly exposed on this thread so you will excuse me if I take what you have to say on the matter with a pinch of salt. And you can relax, no one will be facing your God since its existence hasn't been established any more than the flying spaghetti monster has, and your bald assertions do nothing to change that. (ETA: duly noted that you are back to the nasty threats. I thought you were over that but apparently not.)



Talk is cheap Michael. But what about your awful talk against the flying spaghetti monster. I guess you'll be sorry when you meet him, huh?





Well let us know when he gets his Nobel for being a science ignoramus. That will be novel!

 

[noguru]

Why do you feel that is a remotely important or interesting question?

He is playing his game of "try to stump the random evolutionistststs". It is a rather foolish game, rife with empty bluster. But it seems to be the only game in town for the YEC crowd.

 

[alwight]

If you don't know, feel free to say so.

Stripe, your drive-by swipes are always as welcome as they are enlightening and salutary. lain:

 

[Stripe]

Why do you feel that is a remotely important or interesting question?

Stripe, your drive-by swipes are always as welcome as they are enlightening and salutary. lain:

If you don't know, feel free to say so. :up:

The challenge to evolution from entropy is that copies always show degradation without informed input. Alwight said the sun can overcome this challenge by providing energy. I want him to explain how the sun can increase the complexity of DNA.

 

[alwight]

Energy is not entropy.

Well spotted, did I say otherwise? :idunno:

What you need to do is show how the sun increases DNA's complexity.

Well, the fact that we are here obviously shows that great complexity exists and that a trail of evidence can be followed back to a time of apparent lesser complexity is something I find rather more compelling than a mindless literal adherence to an ancient scripture.

 

[Stripe]

Well spotted, did I say otherwise? :idunno: Well, the fact that we are here obviously shows that great complexity exists and that a trail of evidence can be followed back to a time of apparent lesser complexity is something I find rather more compelling than a mindless literal adherence to an ancient scripture.

If you don't know, feel free to say so. :up:

The challenge to evolution from entropy is that, without informed input, copies always show degradation. You said the sun can overcome this challenge by providing energy, but you cannot explain how the sun can increase the complexity of DNA.

 

[gcthomas]

If you don't know, feel free to say so. :up:

The challenge to evolution from entropy is that copies always show degradation without informed input. Alwight said the sun can overcome this challenge by providing energy. I want him to explain how the sun can increase the complexity of DNA.

That your post has been copied many times as it travelled from your computer to mine shows that your statement is completely false.

Demonstrating your pre-education understanding of thermodynamics doesn't come close to explaining why your oft-refuted question is remotely interesting enough for anyone you answer yet again.

If you can't give a good reason, just admit it to yourself.

 

[alwight]

If you don't know, feel free to say so. :up:

The challenge to evolution from entropy is that, without informed input,copies always show degradation. You said the sun can overcome this challenge by providing energy, but you cannot explain how the sun can increase the complexity of DNA.

What I said was that as energy is increased into an open system then entropy declines.
There is no reason I'm aware of to suppose that entropy must therefore be applied to evolution and DNA that it somehow must override natural selection and the resulting greater complexity of life.

 

[Stripe]

That your post has been copied many times as it travelled from your computer to mine shows that your statement is completely false.

No, it doesn't.

For one, the process of getting the message I typed onto your screen is not an uninformed one. There are error-checking routines working all the way to make sure the message is transferred as intended.

Degradation does happen, but intelligent people have worked hard to make sure the message is retained, asking for parts — sometimes all of it — to be sent again when required.

And second, what you took exception to was the least controversial part of all this. Entropy is physical reality. Things degrade. It takes an evolutionist to demand that physical reality does not apply.

Demonstrating your pre-education understanding of thermodynamics doesn't come close to explaining why your oft-refuted question is remotely interesting enough for anyone you answer yet again. If you can't give a good reason, just admit it to yourself.

If you don't know, feel free to say so.

Meanwhile, the challenge remains: Evolution has to face up to entropy, which dictates that copies always show degradation without informed input. Evolutionists claim that because the sun provides energy, the challenge does not apply. I want them to explain how the sun can increase the complexity of DNA.

Typically, they run for the hills.

 

[Stripe]

What I said was that as energy is increased into an open system then entropy declines.

Which is nowhere near an accurate statement. If a tornado (increased energy) blasts through a town (open system), entropy increases.

It takes informed action to decrease entropy, and that only locally. Sometimes even that is not good enough.

There is no reason I'm aware of to suppose that entropy must therefore be applied to evolution and DNA that it somehow must override natural selection and the resulting greater complexity of life.

It's called physical necessity. Everything in science must adhere to the facts of science. Evolution has to face the challenges posed to it by reality, not insist that physics bow to the theory.

This is the problem; evolutionists are brainwashed into desperately defending their religion at all costs. They do not practice science.

So, the challenge remains: Explain how the sun can increase the complexity of DNA.

 

[noguru]

Stripe is just blowing smoke again. It is out of desperation that he plays these games.

His question has been answered many times, yet he simply refuses to acknowledge the answer. This is exactly why in real science people like Stripe are just laughed at. And their only remaining front for dubious debate remains on web sites like this designed to preach to choir of previously converted YECs. All he is doing is trying to get a pat on the back from other mindless YECs. His objections have no scientific merit.

 

[noguru]

It's called physical necessity. Everything in science must adhere to the facts of science. Evolution has to face the challenges posed to it by reality, not insist that physics bow to the theory.

The question has been answered. The answer to your alleged problem of the second law of thermodynamics is the first law of thermodynamics. Photosynthesis/chemo synthesis utilizes the first law to convert energy (from the sun and other chemicals) into usable energy in a living organisms. Metabolism is how this is achieved. Metabolism allows the animal/plant to live. Copying errors in reproduction bring about novelties in phenotypes. The successful phenotypes gain a reproductive advantage and those characteristics flourish. I will explain this again, should you ask the question again. And you will continue to look like the fool that you are for not acknowledging the answer.

Good luck my small minded YEC friend. Choose wisely.

 

[gcthomas]

Agreed. Nowhere in the statistical thermodynamics courses I took was intelligent intervention required for local entropy to decrease. But his mention on intelligence exposes why he is desperate to find a chink in evolution, even if it means he has to expose his ignorance about physics to do so.

 

[noguru]

Agreed. Nowhere in the statistical thermodynamics courses I took was intelligent intervention required for local entropy to decrease. But his mention on intelligence exposes why he is desperate to find a chink in evolution, even if it means he has to expose his ignorance about physics to do so.

He is the supreme moron on this site. And he is heralded as a hero by some because of his obstinate approach in refusing to accept the very clear reality right in front of him. He is certainly very clever in his attempts at avoiding reality.

I find it amazing that some people applaud his strategy. The ones that do applaud his efforts, expose their own sleazy strategy of life.

Some people spend so much time and effort trying to demonstrate how clever they are by avoiding reality, that they end up making themselves fools.

 

[gcthomas]

He is the supreme moron on this site. And he is heralded as a hero by some because of his obstinate approach in refusing to accept the very clear reality right in front of him.

Telling the blind that black is white seems to be his only actual skill. It is a shame he is such a complete numpty.

 

[Stripe]

Nowhere in the statistical thermodynamics courses I took was intelligent intervention required for local entropy to decrease.

That's nice. When you've finished with your implied straw-man argument, perhaps you'd like to retract the errors from your previous post.

Meanwhile, still no explanation for how the sun increases the complexity of DNA.

 

[noguru]

Telling the blind that black is white seems to be his only actual skill. It is a shame he is such a complete numpty.

He is definitely a shyster.

I'll be back later folks. I have to go finish a tile job up in Tamarac.

 

[noguru]

That's nice. When you've finished with your implied straw-man argument, perhaps you'd like to retract the errors from your previous post.

Meanwhile, still no explanation for how the sun increases the complexity of DNA.

The question has been answered. The answer to your alleged problem of the second law of thermodynamics is the first law of thermodynamics. Photosynthesis/chemo synthesis utilizes the first law to convert energy (from the sun and other chemicals) into usable energy in a living organisms. Metabolism is how this is achieved. Metabolism allows the animal/plant to live. Copying errors in reproduction bring about novelties in phenotypes. The successful phenotypes gain a reproductive advantage and those characteristics flourish. I will explain this again, should you ask the question again. And you will continue to look like the fool that you are for not acknowledging the answer.

Good luck my small minded YEC friend. Choose wisely.

I am pretty sure the cowardly Stripe has me on ignore. Because he does not have the intestinal fortitude to face reality squarely.

What he seems to miss also, is that the more he repeats the question and gets an answer, the more likely a person who is willing to learn will see the answer. In the end Stripe is only damaging his own credibility.

 

[gcthomas]

That's nice. When you've finished with your implied straw-man argument, perhaps you'd like to retract the errors from your previous post.

Tell me what you think is in error, and I'll explain it to you with short words when I've finished laughing. :up:

Meanwhile, still no explanation for how the sun increases the complexity of DNA.

Not needed. You're the one making the rather big claim that the thermodynamic sciences are not what Physicists believe them to be, it is up to you to provide a proof of error, despite it being patiently explained to you again and again.

You do have amusement value here, so carry on!